DD and Horcruxes/ Scrimgeour

[dumbledore11214]

No: HPFGUIDX 179634

> Pippin:
> 
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/HPforGrownups/message/160487
> > > > Alla,
> > > >
> > > > who wishes that Marauders had in their mist somebody as 
ruthless
> as Hermione to mark traytor before he did any serious damage.
> 
> Pippin:
> I realize now you were hoping that Pettigrew had been a traitor in
> his school days and he could have been caught then. But since
> he wasn't, do you still agree with this?

Alla:

Thanks.
Do I still agree that I hope that somebody as ruthless as Hermione 
would have caught Pettigrew? I think I do. But now more than ever I 
just do not see what this has to do with my point of Dumbledore 
trusting his soldiers. I am just not seeing the contradiction between 
being ruthless to potential traitors and trusting people.

 
> Alla:
>  He would show : a. that he trusts people BUT b. that 
> > he also takes extra precautions in case there is a traitor in the 
mi
> 
> Pippin:
> 
> But that's what Harry didn't want to do in DH. He didn't want
> the order members to start suspecting each other,  looking
> over their shoulders, and worrying that they'll be
> the suspect, as Harry often was.
> 
> Surely you can see that announcing anti-traitor measures is going 
to 
> foster suspicions that there is a traitor to be caught? A real 
morale-raiser 
> that. Sirius and Lupin did as much damage by suspecting each other 
as
> Pettigrew ever did. 
> 
> And it's even worse if you act like only *some* people
> are under suspicion. Yuck.

Alla:

BUT you brought the announcing antitraitor measures in the mix, not 
me. As I said above I am just seeing no contradiction here.

To me the **action** of safeguarding against the traitor does not 
mean that Hermione does not trust everybody by the way. I think she 
is just cautious and ready to do anything to defend her friends.

If Dumbledore did not want to announce the spells, whatever. I just 
want him to not keep everything to himself, including horcruzes. I 
find it awfully obnoxious and patronising too.

Pippin:
<SNIP> 
> There is just no canon that anyone could have found the horcruxes
> faster than Harry did. 

Alla:

Eh, that's because nobody got a chance to try IMO.

Pippin:
If  Harry had told the Order his theory that
> Tom Riddle had located the lost diadem years before he came to
> power, secretly brought it back to Hogwarts and hidden it in the 
RoR,
> I'm sure they would have done their best to talk him out of it. 

Alla:

How do you know that? I think I can just as confidently say that they 
would have done their best to help him. That's what Mcgonagall does 
after all when he asks for help and Flitwick and DA and and Arthur 
participates in Ron's plan with ghoul no questions asked. I mean, he 
asked, but when stopped.

Oh and let's not forget Lupin who is eager to help as well. Putting 
his issues with Tonks aside, I think he was quite sincere and would 
have helped as well.

Nope, not buying that they would talked him out of it, I think even 
if they tried, the words Dumbledore wanted me to do it would have 
been enough. IMO.

Pippin:
> I'm sure they'd have talked him out of raiding the Ministry of 
Magic,
> too.  And as for a Gringotts vault, we have an Order member's
> opinion on that: yer'd have ter be mad ter try it, or words to that
> effect.
> 
> You've got to admit it's far-fetched. 

Alla:

See above.

 
> Pippin:
> Exactly they signed up for danger. They signed up to fight in a 
secret
> organization because they recognized a need to keep Voldemort
> from finding out things that will help him to win the war. 
> 
> They did not sign up to be told what those things are. They
> know Voldemort may try to kill them, but why give Voldemort 
> additional reasons to want to do it? "There are dangers involved
> of which you have no idea, any of you." --Lupin, OOP.


Alla:

They signed up for danger and dying without being told what they are 
dying for? I disagree. I think they deserve to know.

And if it helps the mission, I think they would happily take on 
additional reasons for Voldemort to kill them, after all helping the 
Chosen One is what matters the most, does it not?