Weasley Family Dynamics (was:Re: The Molly Question (long!)...)

[horridporrid03]

No: HPFGUIDX 164936

> >>Betsy Hp:
> > I'd unleashed the hounds. <g>  But pulling back a bit, I agree   
> > that Molly is more than likely supposed to be more a character of 
> > comedy than anything else.  A "Mrs. Bennet" (of "Pride and       
> > Prejudice") type I think.

> >>Carol:
> Do you really think so?

Betsy Hp:
Oy, that's as nice as I get with regards to Molly, Carol. <g>  Rather 
than emotionally abusive, she's... funny.  Yeah. 

> >>Carol:
> Mrs. Bennett is a grown-up Lydia, formerly a pretty young flirt and 
> still flighty and brainless.

Betsy Hp:
So far, so Molly. 

> >>Carol:
> her one ambition is to marry off her daughters.

Betsy Hp:
Right.  Molly's sole ambition is to get her sons into the Ministry, 
and probably marry off Ginny (who's fixated like a little duckling 
onto the WW's most eligible bachelor, so no worries for Molly there).

> >>Carol:
> Neither she nor Mr. Bennett ever disciplines the girls, who do as   
> they please (within the limits allowed by their society) whether    
> it's play the piano, read a novel, or run off after the soldiers.   
> They're not expected to help at home ("We ar quite able to keep a   
> cook, Mr. Collins!")

Betsy Hp:
Mrs. Bennet runs her home at the level of her social rung.  A 
gentleman's household should have a cook.  But the Bennet girls do 
have talents.  They aren't completely wild.  The issue with the 
Bennet household is the wrong sort of ambition, not complete 
negligence.  

> >>Carol:
> Molly expects her sons (and presumably Ginny) to help with the
> de-gnoming or cutting up the potatoes (IIRC).

Betsy Hp:
And she sends them all off to boarding school.  Again, keeping her 
family on their social rung.

> >>Carol:
> She also tries to maintain discipline, though her idea of doing so 
> is to yell at them, send a Howler, go through their pockets using   
> Accio, or burn their order forms. It's a lot more than Mrs. Bennett 
> does.

Betsy Hp:
I disagree. And actually, the way Molly completely misses the point 
of what went wrong with the twins is exactly like Mrs. Bennet misses 
the point of her girls' social interactions.  What I do think the two 
women have in common is their tendency to descend into histrionics 
and shrieking.  They're both rather emotional and excitable.  Which 
is where the comedy is supposed to come in I think.

> >>Carol:
> <snip>
> Molly may be primarily a comic figure, and she certainly presents as
> much of a contrast in her way to Arthur (usually as lax a
> disciplinarian as the more intellectual but still ineffectual Mr.
> Bennett), but she also genuinely cares about her children and their
> futures and about Harry.

Betsy Hp:
Yes, I think Arthur is a lot like Mr. Bennet too.  But I'm not sure 
how Molly loving her children makes her different from Mrs. Bennet.  
Mrs. Bennet was very concerned about her daughters' future, and I 
always took the concern as genuine.

> >>Carol:
> <snip>
> Mrs. Bennett, superficial and shallow, loves the silly,            
> flirtacious, and ultimately promiscuous Lydia above the more
> intelligent, steady, and sensible Elizabeth and Jane.

Betsy Hp:
Ah.  See I wouldn't say Mrs. Bennet *loves* Lydia more, but she 
certainly *understands* Lydia more.  Just as Molly has a better 
connection with Ginny and the twins than she does with Ron (or, IMO, 
Percy for that matter).  But I'd say if asked she'd say she loved 
them all the same.

> >>Betsy Hp:
> > <snip>
> > I think Arthur didn't like that his cause wasn't taken seriously 
> > while Molly didn't like that Arthur was taken for his cause. 

> >>Carol:
> I don't really understand this last sentence, but as I understand   
> it, Molly doesn't like the way Arthur's affection for Muggles (or   
> Muggle artifacts) holds him back at the Ministry.
> <snip>

Betsy Hp:
Molly would like Arthur to get over his interest in Muggles and their 
treatment at the hands of Wizards.  She wants Arthur to get over his 
cause and work on moving up the Ministry ladder.  Whereas Arthur is 
frustrated that no one at the Ministry is taking his issue, his 
cause, seriously.

> >>Carol:
> The Twins and Molly view Arthur quite realistically, IMO, as a
> loveable eccentric.
> <snip>

Betsy Hp:
Arthur is lovable and he is eccentric.  But he's also quite right 
about the way wizards view muggles.  Unfortunately, Molly cannot see 
that side of Arthur.  So she sees him wasting his time on a worthless 
cause all for the sake of a silly little hobby.

> >>Carol:
> I think (correct me if I'm wrong) that you see Muggle rights as     
> some sort of cause for Mr. Weasley, who certainly doesn't approve  
> of the Twins' conduct toward Dudley or Willy Widdershin's blocking 
> Muggle toilets, but he's also rather fondly condescending toward    
> Muggles ("Bless them!") and has no real understanding of them at   
> all.

Betsy Hp:
Well, Arthur does sacrifice his Ministry career to take up the cause 
of Muggle treatment, so yeah I do see it as "some sort of cause" for 
him.  That he's not perfect at it is fine, IMO.  Adds character 
interest.

> >>Carol:
> As for Molly, there's no indication whether she does or doesn't    
> share his views.

Betsy Hp:
Obviously, given the examples I've raised previously, I disagree. <g>

> >>Carol:
> <snip>
> But she doesn't care about money for its own sake, or she'd         
> heartily approve of the Twins and their money-making pranks and     
> gadgets.

Betsy Hp:
As soon as they start to make money, Molly *does* approve.

> >>Carol:
> (Note that it's the Ton-tongue Toffees like those used on Dudley   
> that she confiscates before the QWC. She certainly doesn't approve 
> of that little incident.)

Betsy Hp:
That they were continuing to waste their time on pranks.  She doesn't 
say a word about Muggle abuse.

> >>Carol:
> <snip>
> I absoluetly don't see her "having issue" with Arthur's taking up   
> Muggle rights, only his obsession with plugs and batteries and so   
> forth affecting his career.

Betsy Hp:
Exactly.  That's how Molly sees Arthur's cause: an obsession with 
plugs and batteries.  Arthur is wasting his time in a dead end 
section of the Ministry when he should be working to move onto other, 
more popular and powerful areas.  Whereas Arthur would like his 
section of the Ministry to become more powerful so that wizards would 
start taking seriously the question of abusing muggles.

> >>Carol:
> Let's face it; he's as obsessed with Muggle artifacts as we are    
> with the HP books, and that's pretty pathetic. :-) If he really    
> knew about and understood Muggles, surely he'd know how we dress!

Betsy Hp:
Or funny.  I think JKR sees the Weasleys as a good source of comedy.  
But I do think Arthur's interest in muggles goes a bit beyond 
electricity.  That he was actually angry at the twins in GoF suggests 
he believes what he says.

Betsy Hp