Do you agree? (Harry as Horcrux)

[Mike]

No: HPFGUIDX 163771

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "justcarol67" wrote:
> Carol:
> <snip> 
> On a side note, there's no proof that Tom Riddle created one or more
> Horcruxes at sixteen, as some posters seem to take for granted. 

Mike:
Maybe, but there is no proof that he didn't either. But there is much 
more canon that he did rather than didn't make a Horcrux at sixteen.


> Carol cont:
> His questions to Slughorn, and his unchanged appearance, indicate 
> that he had not yet done so. <snip>

Mike:
I, for one, have no problem believing that Tom Riddle knew how to 
play Slughorn after years in his house and being in the Slug Club. 
Also, Dumbledore admitted that the possibility of multiple Horcruxes 
was critical information to Tom. Lastly, how much change in 
appearance does one Horcrux make? How do we know Tom's appearance 
*didn't* change? I think you are assuming information that is not in 
canon, not that you can't do that. But it comes awkwardly after the 
sentence where you have averred that there is "no proof".

> Carol cont:
> I don't think that the diary, though it contained one or more 
> memories and was enchanted to be interactive (rather like the 
> portraits, the Sorting Hat, and the Marauder's Map) was a 
> Horcrux at this point. 

Mike:
Ah, to the meat of the matter. You are referring to the *supposed* 
diary's condition after creation as a repository of memories, but not 
yet imbued with a soul piece. Since we have no knowledge of how that 
particular diary would function, you can claim it operates any way 
you would like and noone can reliably dispute it. Conversely, I could 
say that the paintings, the Sorting Hat, and the Marauder's Map have 
never manifested into human form (or nearly human had Harry not 
stopped the process). 

Therefore; I feel that your analogy relies upon a condition (pre-
Horcrux) which we have no canon to reference. Also, the diary starts 
out, in the beginning of CoS, with actions that "mere memories" could 
not accomplish, to wit: "... act and think for itself? .." (DD in HBP 
ch 23) All the things the diary did with Ginny, *before* Harry got 
his hands on it, demonstrated it was a Horcrux repository. To say it 
reverts to something more primitive after Harry gets ahold of it does 
not hold water, IMO.

As to Tom not creating the Horcrux when he was sixteen; this presumes 
that the soul piece chose what age to become when it rtegenerated 
into human form. The obvious question would be: Why didn't the other 
soul piece we saw regenerate also choose a younger, heathier form? 
Why did LV have to regenerate into the deformed state that came out 
of the cauldron?

I have to go with Tom Riddle's own words, "... preserving my sixteen-
year-old self in its pages,..." (Cos ch 17). You may not consider 
this to be proof, but combined with the fact that Tom did put a piece 
of his soul in the diary, I'm not sure JKR could have made it more 
clear without getting clinical.


 
> Carol, firmly believing that the Horcrux hunt will *not* culminate 
> in Harry's discovery that he or his scar is a Horcrux or in his
> self-sacrifice to destroy a soul bit in himself

Mike:
I am a Harry-is-a-Horcrux camper. Not to go into that so much as to 
defend our camp on a point of order. Being in our camp does *not* 
require us to believe that Harry is going to sacrifice himself in the 
end. There are just as many Horcrux!Harry campers in Geoff's IWHTL 
club as not <that is, if he'll let us in :-)>. There are many 
theories floating around as to how Harry can safely get the Horcrux 
*OUT*, which of course means those people believe both in the Horcrux!
Harry and in IWHTL.