Snape - a werewolf bigot?? Was: Say it isn't so Lupin!!!

[colebiancardi]

No: HPFGUIDX 170227

 
> zgirnius:
> > It is in my opinion debatable, but there is definitely evidence 
> > favoring the idea that James Potter saved Snape's life in that 
> > incident, and that Snape had a consequent life debt to James. None 
> > of this could have happened if Snape's life were not threatened in 
> > that incident.
> <snip>
> 
> Dana:
> No, it isn't debatable because the definite outcome is not debatable. 
> Snape did not die and he did not survive a werewolf attack to truly 
> have *experience* with the danger a werewolf could posse. It just 
> could have died that is it but it was prevented by James. All the 
> danger was taken away when James intervened and therefore James saved 
> Snape from ever having to encounter a werewolf. Snape only glimpsed 
> werewolf Lupin and did not experience a fight with werewolf Lupin and 
> did not have a struggle for his life with werewolf Lupin and survived 
> it. 
> 
> It is the difference between being in a plane that crashed and 
> surviving and missing a flight and then the airplane you should have 
> been on crashed. The former *experienced* the crash but survived and 
> but could have died and the later, could have died if he had made it 
> to the plane in time but did not *experience* the crash in itself. 

<snipping>
colebiancardi:

hmmm, I must have cut out too much, as I did respond to a lot in this
thread.   Trying to recreate:

I am not sure why the issue of James' saving Snape's life is even
under debate. Dumbledore states that James SAVED Snape's life.  Lupin
acknowledges it, Sirius acknowledges(begrudgingly, of course) and even
Snape acknowledges it, although he does think that James was in on the
prank in the beginning and then got cold feet.  If James didn't save
Snape's life, there would be no life-debt.  However we do have a life
debt that Snape owes.   Everyone in canon acknowledges that Snape was
in danger.  I will go with that one.

Your analogy of the plane crash is not applicable to this scenario,
IMHO.  Haven't you heard of people getting traumatized by events that
were second hand to them?  Case in point, 9/11.  

At any rate, the danger that Snape was in is not second hand.  If
James hadn't shown up, there would have been only two outcomes for
Teen!Snape:
a) killed by Lupin
b) bitten by Lupin and turned into a werewolf himself

 
> 
> 
> zgirnius:
> <snip>
> > Surely at the point at which Snape saw the werewolf, he could just 
> > turn around and walk back out, if Lupin were indeed far away and no 
> > threat?
> 
> Dana:
> Yes, he indeed could have just walked back before he ever got the 
> change to encounter Lupin and safed his own life but James safed him 
> because Snape did not have the intention of walking back. James could 
> never have pulled Snape out in human form if Lupin had been within 
> striking range. The threat as Lupin states in PoA was only if Snape 
> had made it as far to the Shack and only then would he have faced a 
> fully fletched werewolf. James and Snape probably had an argument 
> that made Lupin come into the tunnel and why Snape was able to glimps 
> him at the end of it. 

colebiancardi:

Canon doesn't state that that James & Snape were arguing & then
CuriousWereWolfie!Lupin came out to see what is what.  Canon states
that it was all in a hurry, that James & Snape were rushing out of the
tunnel, with a snarling werewolf near enough that it caused a
life-debt to be triggered.  I don't think Snape could have seen
WereWolf!Lupin, said to himself "oh, my, lookie here" and then turned
around and walked out in sedate manner.  By downgrading the danger
Snape was in, James' heroic acts are demeaned.  James is no longer a
hero for saving Snape.  If that is the case, there would be no
life-debt.  
  
 
 
> Dana:
> Interesting because he loses that fear/ worry immediately when he 
> sees his chance to catch Lupin red handed in helping his old friend 
> Black and he even forgets that it is possible for Lupin to transform 
> that night when he suggests he will drag the werewolf. 
> 

colebiancardi:

well, there is over 20 years now between Teen!Snape & Adult!Snape. As
HBP showed us, Adult!Snape has grown up to become a very powerful
wizard.  Also, Teen!Snape had NO idea what was waiting for him at the
end of the tunnel.  Snape as a teen had nothing at all to prepare him
for the revelation of WereWolf!Lupin.  Adult!Snape does and I am sure
he has come prepared to handle both Lupin and Sirius.

colebiancardi