On the perfection of moral virtues.

[leslie41]

No: HPFGUIDX 169093


> zgirnius:
> Snape had been suspecting Lupin of being in league with Black all
> year. If he had no idea he would be finding Black at the end of
> that tunnel, I do not believe he would have gone. Lupin forgets his
> potion and decides to go ride the change out in the Shack? Fine.
> The motive to follow had to be that he thought he would finally get
> the proof he needed that Lupin was in league with Black.

Mike:
I'll go along with that motivation for Snape. Which means to me that
Snape is stuck in 'all the Marauders are evil' mode. As Snape has no
proof for his assertion that Lupin is in cahoots with Sirius other
than they were friends at school together. 

Leslie:

Firstly, see my post of 1:32 p.m., in which I answered all of your 
assertions. It seems you either have not seen or are not replying to 
that one, so I will reiterate here where it seems appropriate.  See 
that post for a far more lengthy discourse on some of these issues.  
>From my perspective, the evidence I offer is pretty irrefutable, 
canonically.  

Whatever proof Snape needs that Black and Lupin are in cahoots he 
gets immediately upon his arrival at the Shrieking Shack, when he 
hears Lupin admit that he ventured out of the Shrieking Shack during 
his years at Hogwarts, betraying Dumbledore and greatly endangering 
everyone.  Snape also hears Lupin admit that he refused to reveal 
that Black was an animagus.  Also, Lupin is most obviously not 
attempting to subdue Black. What else would Snape think?

> zgirnius:
> Even if he could get free, he could not get past the Willow in his
> transformed state.

Mike:
How do you figure? How did he get out all those times when they were
the Marauders? Lupin would just move faster on all fours as a
werewolf.

Leslie:
Because it took the Marauders to let him out, that's why.  He 
essentially was "locked in" at the Shrieking Shack, unless someone 
came to get him out.  Obviously that's the case, because what 
protection would the shack have been had they left the door open?

Mike:
But canon shows that Snape fully intended to "drag the werewolf" out
himself. And though it's only a guess, I doubt tying up a werewolf
can stop the transformation from happening. Werewolf!Lupin had no
problem extricating from the shackles, I doubt the rope would have
held him.

Leslie:
Even if we put aside the fact that Snape expected to find two enemies 
there (see my previous post—yes indeed he thought there were two), a 
situation that didn't exactly lend itself to potion-taking, we need 
to remember that a fair amount of time passes between the time Snape 
leaves Hogwarts and the time that Lupin transforms. It takes Snape 
some time to get to the shack, then he's hidden under the 
invisibility cloak for a good while as well.  Then, even after Snape 
is knocked out, there's about 15 pages of dialogue, after which 
everyone has to get out through the tunnel, a rather arduous and 
hardly hasty process. 

Even only considering from the time that Snape is knocked out, I 
would guess that there's a good half hour or 45 minutes that passes 
before Lupin transforms.  Lupin is hardly on the verge of 
transforming when Snape leaves the castle.  Hardly.  During that 45 
minutes, I might add that Lupin doesn't remember he didn't take the 
potion, and he has plenty of time to go back and get it. No one's in 
danger anymore, of course, so there's no excuse anymore 
for "forgetting". 

Mike:
But this brings up another point. Lupin sees the trio leave Hagrid's
Hut with **Peter Pettigrew**. Then he sees *Sirius Black* join the
fray and he, Ron, and Peter head into the willow. Followed shortly
afterwards by Crookshanks, Harry and Hermione. Holy S***. The kids
are heading to the Shreiking Shack with at least one *murderer*.
Lupin cannot tell who has wands, whether Sirius is dragging Ron or
Pettigrew is forcing Sirius and Ron at wand point.

But Lupin is irresponsible for not sitting in his office and waiting
for Snape to show up with his potion. Just let whatever's happening
happen, Lupin. Don't be bothered, remember, you're the wimpy do-
nothing of the Marauders.

Leslie41:
You grant Lupin an enormous amount of leeway that you refuse to grant 
Snape.  Snape believes that a murderer is in the Shrieking Shack 
(again, see my previous post on this), a murderer with whom Lupin is 
in cahoots, a murderer who has made a great mess of Hogwarts and 
scared the bejesus out of everyone, and whom everyone believes wants 
to kill a student.  

Oh, wait!  Snape's got to remember to bring the potion!  To put it in 
some sort of a bubble or something to keep it safe so Lupin can take 
it when Snape gets there!  

That's a speculation I find, at best, fairly incredible, and 
bolstered only by an unreasonable prejudice against Snape.