Identifying with Slytherins was Re: Dark Magic

[prep0strus]

No: HPFGUIDX 176644


> Carol:
> Exactly. Severus believed that Slytherin was the house for brains,
> James that Gryffindor was the house of chivalry (though his behavior
> was anything but chivalrous). Sirius knew only that his family had
> been in Slytherin and that James disliked Slytherin and he wanted to
> be friends with James. He says that maybe he'll break tradition. Then
> James trips Severus and Sirius (apparently) calls him Snivellus for no
> cause other than his desire to be in a house that James doesn't like.

Prep0strus:
And here is where your opinions and conjecture come into play.  You
believe he is doing it solely for that reason, while many posters have
previously stated examples of why they feel his choice may be
influenced by the upbringing he had, from disagreeing with his parents
statements, from hearing things from his cousin, or observing things
in the world.  these opinions are no less valid.  We're not even sure
he's the one who says it.


Carol:
> If physical appearance came into it, we don't see it, but the narrator
> does note (from Harry's pov) that James looked well cared for and
> Severus didn't. The whole scene is very much on the same level as
> Harry's first and second encounters with Draco--eleven-year-olds
> forming judgments and holding prejudices based on the expectations of
> their parents, and, in Sirius's case, a conflict between his family's
> views and those of his new friend. You may think that he hasn't yet
> made up his mind, but it's pretty clear to me that he's rejected
> Slytherin (and a kid he doesn't even know who wants to be in it) based
> solely on his desire to remain on good terms with James. Otherwise,
> the sneer at Severus for having neither brains nor brawn (it's obvious
> he's not brawny, but neither is Sirius or James, and he has no idea of
> Severus's intelligence, which is quite the match of his) and the nasty
> nickname Snivellus (a distortion of Severus's name with no other
> basis) are inexplicable, as is his approval of James tripping Severus
> for no reason.

Prep0strus:
Again, only your opinion.  We don't know that he's made up his mind to
reject Slytherin, we don't know that if he has the reason is James, or
only James.  We don't know how the hat works, or how much of it is
based on choice, and we don't know what is in these boys' heads.  Your
opinion is certainly valid, and makes sense, but it is not my opinion,
nor the opinion of other posters, who can look at the same presented
information and see it quite differently.


> Prep0strus:
>   And I've said many times I believe they knew what was going on in
> the world. <snip>
> 
> Carol response:
> You may believe that, but as Hermione says of Crumple-Horned
> Snorkacks, where's the evidence? 

Prep0strus:
I don't have evidence.  I believe it based on common sense and based
on what we see in harry's generation.  Those kids know what went on in
their past.  They are aware of prisoners in azkaban.  they've heard of
Sirius black, they know of harry potter.  they know of accused death
eaters, and they know of slytherin.  in the pensieve, we see a few
years after the train lily making direct comment on what is going on
in the world.  No, I do not have a scene where all the Marauders and
Snape and Lucius sit around and talk about what's going on in world
politics.  But I do not think that my view of it is preposterous or
not based on canon.



> Carol responds:
> It's more than that. Snape was right about James. He was arrogant. And
> worse than arrogant, he was a bully who misjudged Severus from the
> moment Severus expressed a desire to be in Slytherin (a house that he
> mistakenly thought that Lily could be in, too). And Sirius joins with
> him in his prejudice, calling Severus unearned nicknames and rejecting
> his parents's house at least in part because of James. Young Severus,
> though he has his flaws, is primarily a sympathetic figure, a plant
> left in the dark with only one real friend. 
> 

Prep0strus:
And this, again, is your opinion.  You think Snape was right about
James, but I believe that James was right about Slytherin.  They were
evil, they were dark, and they were about to try to take over the
world.  You still blame Sirius for a nickname that we don't know came
from him (not that it matters whether it came from James or Sirius). 
You still focus primarily on the bullying aspects of the Marauders and
not on the park arts practicing and looking ahead to voldemorte
aspects of the slytherins.  it's choice and opinion - what you're
stating is no more canon fact that what those of us who disagree with
you believe.  That includes how sympathetic Severus is.  He must be,
to you, and many others, but I don't find him all that sympathetic.
'only one real friend', which discounts every slytherin who apparently
took him in as their own, who exerted great influence on him.  that
one friend was more than harry ever had before getting to school. 
probably more than neville had the first 4 years of school.  I know
Snape is sympathetic to many people, but he's not to me.

The Snape discussion has been gone over again and again.  I rarely
think of something new to say, and rarely read something new about it.
 I've been posting a little more about Slytherins in general. 
Opinions won't really change about Snape.  I stand firmly in the
SnapeMeh camp, because I just don't care.  he doesn't interest me a
great deal as a character, i find him repulsive as a person, and the
vehement defense and adulation of him baffle me.  I often find myself
drawn in because my sympathies do like with the Marauders, and I find
certain readings of a very sympathetic and likeable Snape silly, but
really, my feelings toward him are more of boredom and disdain. 
There's no way to 'prove' either opinion, no matter how detailed the
reading of the text.

~Prep0strus, who thinks it would be nice if the whole wizarding world
and simply abolished Slytherin, made socially taboo their views, and
made the houses based on traits of equal merit and no moral connotations.