Disappointment Was: Deaths in DH WAS: Re: Dumbledore (but more Snape)

[lealess]

No: HPFGUIDX 177481

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "dumbledore11214" 
<dumbledore11214 at ...> wrote:
>
> > the tiny instances in which I have misspoken and address those 
> > instead of addressing the whole thing.  Such is life.
> <SNIP>
> 
> Alla:
> 
> You do not like saying it because someone may address one point 
> instead of whole thing?
> 
> What if I find only one or two or three points disagreeable?
> 
> Obviously I am not going to argue with your dislike of the book, 
> because indeed how can we debate perceptions, but I certainly want 
> to adress this point.
> 

Actually, I meant tiny things like using Dobby instead of Kreacher, 
things that any rushed modern person can do.  Thanks for asking for 
the clarification.

> Lealess:
> <SNIP>
> > I have read eloquent appraisals of DH since its publication, and 
> they 
> > all seem like wish fulfillment to me, as if people are filling in 
> the 
> > writing that JKR did not do herself, "this is what she meant."  
> This 
> > is funny to me, since ... what are expectations, after all?
> > 
> <snip> 
> 
> Alla:
> 
> So I just want to strongly disagree that the praise of DH means
> wish fulfillment or filling in the blanks for what JKR meant to do 
> but did not.
> 
> I left in that exchange between you and Carol (hoping that I 
> correctly attributed Carol's words and yours) for a reason.
> 
> 
> I mean, no I cannot say it even for the sake of argument, I think
> it 
> is at least clear that Harry somehow changed his view about Snape,
> no?
> 
> 
> But say Harry did not experience any profound heart change about 
> Snape and Draco, he just respects Snape for his bravery and still 
> thinks they are the biggest gits on Earth.
> 
> 
> That IS what you read in canon, yes?
> 
> My point is that I consider Harry change of heart or NOT change of 
> heart towards Snape and Draco to be so very **tiny** part of the 
> story that I do not care either way.
> 

Yes, Harry did change his opinion of Snape.  All we know of this 
change is how brave he felt Snape was and he gave his third child a 
middle name of Severus.  Other than that, I could speculate all day, 
as nothing else is plainly indicated.  If you take JKR's own comments 
on the subject, she still finds Snape to be deeply horrible, but 
brave.  Based on the text, I have no idea what Harry's complete 
feelings towards Snape are.  Harry might just admire bravery more 
than anything else.

> I think Carol's reading is plausible and yours is plausible too.
> 
> But to me Harry Potter books had **NEVER** been the stories of 
> Draco and Snape OR the stories of Slytherin House fall and 
> redemption.
> 
> To me they had always been stories about **Harry Potter** first and 
> foremost, and everybody else ( Yes, I know Snape is important to 
> the plot, but I still think of him same way as other characters) is
> just a supporting player on Harry's journey.
> 
> So, what I was looking for in DH just as every other book is the 
> satisfying resolution for Harry's journey first and foremost.
> 
> I believe I got it all there straight on the page, I do not think 
> it is wish fulfillment.

You got your wish!  I agree that the books are about Harry.  I did 
not find his resolution as satisfying as you did and was reading for 
other things, but as your reading is on the page, I cannot see wish-
fulfillment in it.  However, if you were reading resolutions into the 
story that are extrapolations based on what you would have liked to 
see, then I would say you are engaging in wish-fulfillment.

> I got Harry fighting, growing, falling in love, experiencing 
> tremendous loss, grieving, laughing, I got all of that in 
tremendous 
> amounts.
> 
> I am happy indeed.
> 
> So, no, not wish fullfilment, except maybe in a sense that I got 
> Harry survive.
> 
> 
> Obviously JMO,
> 
> Alla
>

JMO, too.

lealess