Lupin's behavior (Was: CHAPDISC: DH11, The Bribe)

[a_svirn]

No: HPFGUIDX 180684

> > Magpie:
> > The reason he's saying he shouldn't be with his family isn't that 
> his 
> > illness makes him unable to handle responsibility but that his 
very 
> > presence is a danger to them--which is true--under the current 
> regime. 
> 
> zgirnius:
> It is not his presence that is the danger, it is his *existence*. 
> Bella might or might not leave Tonks alone once she is no longer 
> pregnant, but little Teddy, once he is born, is someone who needs 
to 
> be 'pruned' from her family tree regardless. His family is already 
> associated with him.

a_svirn:
Well, perhaps Lupin hoped to prune Bellatrix first. That should have 
done the trick. 

> zgirnius:
> Harry's most notable noble leaving of someone because of the danger 
> it would put her in, is his breakup with Ginny at the end of HBP. 
> Which, while it had not occured to me before, was quite possibly a 
> contributing factor to Harry's anger, though secondary to the issue 
> of abandoning a child, which is a sore point with Harry.

a_svirn:
And so he takes his frustration on Lupin who is doing the same very 
thing? 

> zgirnius:
also 
> tries this speech on Ron and Hermione, who turn him down. Of 
course, 
> in all three of those cases, he tells the people in question what 
is 
> going on. My own impression of Lupin from that scene is that he 
makes 
> his decision without consulting Tonks, which is the source of my 
> problems.

a_svirn:
And do you remember Harry consulting Ginny? I remember him presenting 
her with a fait accompli. 

> zgirnius:
> I can concoct in my mind a fanfic, which seems to me completely AU, 
> in which, before coming to Harry, Lupin confesses to Tonks that 
> despite his love for her and the baby, he worries about them and 
the 
> danger their association with him puts them in so very much.

a_svirn:
Well I don't see why it is so completely AU, since there is nothing 
in canon to contradict it. 

> zgirnius:
And 
> Tonks is happy to know Lupin's recent moodiness does not mean he 
> loves her any less or does not want the baby, and also annoyed that 
> he might think this matters to her, and assures him that she 
married 
> him fully aware of the possible consequences, that the blame would 
be 
> hers as much as anyone's if anything went wrong, and the happiness 
he 
> has brought her means more to her than the risk.

a_svirn:
What an odd scenario. Welfare and safety of her child should jolly 
well matter to her. 

> Pippin:
> IIRC, the point of Harry's conversation with Phineas was to show us 
that
> Harry was rationalizing: he told himself that he was worried about 
the
> danger to his friends, but he was more worried about being different
> from them in a horrible and unique way. Now Harry perceives that 
> Lupin is doing the same thing. 

a_svirn:
Now aren't you being unfair to Harry. The point of Harry's decision 
to leave No. 12 was that he thought himself "Voldemort's secret 
weapon" and consequently the danger to his nearest and dearest. Which 
is very similar to how Lupin saw himself. 

> Pippin:
> Just as Harry forgot about Diary!Ginny, Lupin has forgotten that 
Harry 
> knows something about being treated as an outcast by his own 
> family and being viewed as a dangerous  freak with criminal 
> propensities and powers he could not control. I think we can imagine
> what it would have meant to Harry during those times to know that
> he had a father who cared for him, even one who couldn't do anything
> to help him. I think that  gives Harry the right to state his point 
of
> view, though it could have been done more tactfully. 

a_svirn:
I think it would be a curiously skewed point of view. Harry's father, 
should he have lived wouldn't have been a danger for him. It was the 
other way round – Harry was a very dangerous son to have. It was 
because Harry was a danger to his parents, his Godfather, etc. all 
those people were killed. And knowing first-handed what it's like to 
endanger life of your loved ones, Harry should have seen Lupin's 
point, not wallow in his past insecurities. 

a_svirn