Snape as Harry's protector or not WAS Snape and moral courage LONG

[montavilla47]

No: HPFGUIDX 184698

> Montavilla47:
> <SNIP>
> But accepting it doesn't mean that Snape didn't care. Which is what
> you are arguing. <SNIP>
> 
> Alla:
> 
> No, not quite. I am arguing that he did not care nearly enough to not 
> accept it. I do not think it is the exact same thing.

Montavilla47:
Ah.  I understand.  So, in order for Snape to care *enough* about 
Harry to satisfy you that he's not a sadistic, horrible person, he should
*never* have told Harry about Dumbledore's plan and *never* have given 
Harry the choice of sacrificing his life.  Have I got that clear?

I can see where you're coming from.  Regardless of what their
non-ghost, non-inferi shades say, in their mortal lives, I'm pretty 
sure that Lily, James, Sirius, and Remus would not have gone along
with any plan that involved sacrificing Harry's life.

Conveniently for Dumbledore, they were either dead, kept in the 
dark, or both.

> Alla:
> 
> That is an interesting inference, and I certainly cannot disprove it. 
> But believe me I definitely did not forget this moment, although the 
> creepiness of it makes me shudder every time I remember it.
> 
> I suppose I am just absolutely convinced that he cried over Lily's 
> death and nothing else and that he still cannot let go. I think the 
> fact that he tears apart the letter makes me so convinced, that he 
> just needs to have the piece of handwriting of his beloved in his 
> hand and maybe pretend that it was addressed to him?

Montavilla47:
Yeah, I know.  It creeps me out a little, too.  It's one of those ways
that JKR manages to keep Snape right on the edge between 
sympathetic and not.  

I mean, it seems so selfish and self-absorbed, and down right 
psychotic to tear up the photograph (he doesn't actually tear the
letter) and only take the page of the letter that contains the words,
"Love, Lily."  As though he wants to pretend--even at that point--
that Lily was his and had no connection to the husband, baby, or 
friend.

Also, people tend to point out that the letter really belonged to 
Harry and Snape was stealing it.  Although, in thinking about that
moment, I just realized that Snape wouldn't expect Harry to return
to 12 Grimauld Place.  After all, the kid hates the house, doesn't 
want anything to do with it, and it going to be dead sooner rather
than later. (Not that Dumbledore put any end date on Harry's 
death.  For all Snape knew, Harry wouldn't have to sacrifice himself
until he was a doddering old man.  All Snape really knew was that,
until the snake was being protected, he was supposed to wait,
protect the school to the best of his abilities, and keep an eye on
Nagini.)


> Montavilla47:
> I think you misunderstood me. The "severe punishment" that I meant
> was "lots of detentions in which Harry gets to read about James being
> a jerk" and not "death."
> 
> Alla:
> 
> It is funny because when I reread my initial answer, I thought that I 
> indeed may have misunderstood you, but not in the way you just 
> explained at all. I was rushing out the door and did not have time to 
> ask for clarification in any event.
> 
> So what I thought you may have meant after I already posted my 
> response is that Snape thought that Harry almost getting Draco killed 
> deserves a severe punishment, which to me would have been a perfectly 
> **for once** fair and legit response from Snape.

Montavilla47:
Yes. That's what I did mean.  The detentions were for, as Snape would
infer, Harry almost killing Draco.  Not for James' gang trying to kill 
Snape twenty years earlier, or James annoying Snape by saving his
life, or even James triggering Snape's unforgiveable use of the word
"Mudblood."

The reason I brought up that prank was that Snape might have a 
stronger response to the incident between Harry and Draco, having
once nearly been killed at school himself.

Alla:
> So, in any event yes indeed I did misunderstand you, sorry about 
> that, however, no matter what kind of punishment you meant Snape may 
> have thought Harry deserves **for something that happened when Harry 
> was not even born yet** and Harry himself did not do, my response 
> will be the same – I do not believe that Harry deserves any kind of 
> punishment for that and I hope Snape burns for all eternity in the 
> imaginary hell if he thought that.

Montavilla47:
I'm not sure why you thought I was saying that.  No, I don't think
Harry was being punished *for* the misdeeds of his fathers.  I think
Harry was being punished *with* the misdeeds of his fathers.  (In 
that it caused him emotional turmoil to learn that his father broke
the rules).