James as head boy (Re: Voldemort's Intentions & Snape's Expectations (Hagrid))

[justcarol67]

No: HPFGUIDX 189895

Shelley wrote:
> See for me, that maturity he showed with Lily and protection of his family is a continuation of that sports theme- fiercely loyal to his team (and house) in school, fiercely loyal to his girlfriend, mate and newborn son. It's not replaced by a sense of responsibility as much as his responsibility has been growing all along, right along with his need for challenge and thrill. People who love personal challenges don't stop  being competitive. <snip> He knew the next challenge lay ahead- the prophesy and his family targeted- and they had a plan to win, and I'm sure he thought it was a sports tactic to change Secret Keepers at the last second to keep Voldemort constantly guessing the strategy James would take this time, only that change backfired horribly as James didn't realize that Wormtail had already switched loyalties (thus betraying "their team"). I don't see James as changing all that much, from stupid and reckless to suddenly being a model Head Boy who toed the line; rather I see a James who never stopped being competitive and vibrant in life, who possibly felt trapped into hiding and wouldn't have stayed there for long before he went out and did something bold to get at Voldemort once again.
<snip>
James not being head boy doesn't change at all my understanding of the events as they are described in canon- James is the popular one, he's the "defacto" leader of Griffandor as the Quidditch Captain in a winning season- no Head Boy could have had as much pull over his House or more influence as he had. (Notice when he teased Snape, in Snape's memory, that no one stepped in to challenge him on it.) He didn't need to be head boy at all, nor did he ever "need to change to become responsible". Hagrid's goof, if it was that, simply could have been the mistake that the "real head boy" was someone that people barely remembered, he left that little of a mark in people's minds. But James, James was a hero of Griffandor, and so Hagrid maybe makes the mistake of thinking James had to have been head boy with as much pull as he had on his fellow classmates and on that of the younger 
> students. <snip> I see no need for James to change one bit. Sticking with the sports theme- what do people remember of a star player, or someone who's been idolized the way James was after his death? Do they remember a foul committed in a game? Those faults are overlooked often before the end of the game, and certainly never remembered after the end of a winning season. When people talk about a star player years later, they remember only the good times, and so I don't doubt at all that people forgot what an insensitive jerk James could be at times, especially because in this case James was dead and it would have been bad form to dishonor his memory. <snip>

Carol responds:

As you can tell, I had a hard time snipping this long and interesting post. As most of you know, I don't like James, but I think you're on to something here. I agree that he was not Head Boy (whether the error is Hagrid's or JKR's is irrelevant here--she'll blame it on Hagrid if she concedes the slip). We do know that he was not a Gryffindor Prefect. Remus Lupin got that job (and he was, IMO, as bad at it in his way as James would have been).

Two tiny points--James would not have been Head Boy during the incident when he humiliated Severus Snape because he was only a fifth year. The question is whether he became one later despite his conduct in fifth year (a great deal of which the teachers and DD didn't know about). Also, no Head Boy or Head Girl would have been present during SWM. Only the fifth years, just released from their DADA OWL, would have been present. (It's even possible, though it's not mentioned, that the only witnesses to the incident were Gryffindors, whose territory Severus accidentally wandered into, which would explain why no Prefects besides Lily took action and why no one seemed to object to the bullying.

Second small point: James didn't know the Prophecy or why he, Lily, and Harry had to go into hiding. (DD says later that he and Harry are the only two people who know the entire Prophecy; Snape and LV know part of it.) Had James known the Prophecy, I seriously doubt that he would have blithely tossed his wand on the couch and felt that the family was safe, Secret Keeper or not.

However, I like your idea that he acted as a Quidditch captain, planning strategy to beat the other team by switching Secret Keepers. I agree that he didn't change much (he was always loyal to people he cared about, however small a group that might be, and he was always recklessly courageous).

I also like the idea that his popularity (which must have been greatest among the Gryffindors) had more to do with his being a star Quidditch player and captain of a winning team than anything else. He could probably get away with arrogance and bullying for that reason only, just as celebrities and sports figures get away with behavior that the rest of us wouldn't dream of. (Tiger Woods, anyone?) Within the WW, we need only see how the members of the Wizengamot regarded Ludo Bagman (such a popular sports figure couldn't possibly be an associate of Death Eaters) to see how that sort of idolatry might apply to James--even to some degree among Hufflepuffs and Ravenclaws if his team had recently beaten Slytherin.

At any rate, I think that Shelley is right about James's not changing. He stopped hexing everyone except Severus (who "gave as good as he got"), but only because he wanted Lily to go out with him, not because he had become a different, more responsible person. I doubt that he ever regretted his conduct in fifth year any more than Sirius did. And the little story of James and Sirius as Order members absorbed in the game of chasing Death Eaters (and oblivious to the humanity of the Muggle policemen) shows that he's still the same James, father or not.

Carol, very glad that Harry was not a second James except in looks!