Snape and Harry and expulsion LONG

[dumbledore11214]

No: HPFGUIDX 188869





> Montavilla47:
> Wow.  If Snape isn't controlling his darker impulses to make 
> Harry suffer already, then Snape has the weeniest dark 
> impulses in the world.  I mean, what does Harry's suffering at 
> Snape's hands consist of?  Some snide remarks about the 
> quality of Harry's classwork, some digs at his celebrity 
> status, and detentions (when he catches Harry breaking
> rules).
> 
> Or maybe I'm just underestimating the suffering of a
> sixteen year old boy who misses out on an hour of 
> making out with his girlfriend.

Alla:

Yes, I definitely think you ARE underestimating Harry's sufferings at Snape's hand, IMO of course, since your list is so very incomplete. I am really not in the mood right now to debate how much Snape really makes Harry suffer, but I can add a thing or two to your list.

How about thirteen year old who desperately wants his father to be here to hear his teacher, his teacher of all people to talk that horribly about his father, to whose death Snape contributed? No, I do not care if Snape was hundred percent right, he still had no business doing it in my opinion. 

How about Snape making Harry walk through Great Hall without letting him wash blood of his face? Yes, I think that was that much of deliberate humiliation. I can go on and on and on, but as I said, I really do not want to right now.

So, yes, I think Snape would be controlling his darker impulses if he would want Harry far away from him, safely that is.

 
> 
> > Potioncat:
> > I don't believe that Snape enjoys Harry's presence at all and would be glad to
> > avoid him entirely. 
> > 
> > Alla:
> > See, you guys are funny. (you and Montavilla, I mean, since she expressed the similar thought). So now Snape indeed would have wanted Harry out of sight if it could have been done safely? How is it different from what I had been arguing all along? That Snape does not want Harry dead, but he would have loved to get out of his promise if he knew that somebody else (or something else for all I care) Could you please elaborate on how is it different from my position?
> 
> Montavilla47:
> I don't think it's all that different, to be honest.  The only
> difference that I can see is that I'm taking into account an
> opposing force in Snape's psyche--which is his sense of 
> duty to Dumbledore OR Lily, take your pick, which overrides
> his desire to keep Harry as far away as possible.

Alla:

Ah, ok, good to know. So we are basically in agreement lol, except on what force in his psyche dominates I guess.


Montavilla:
> And, also, although I find the idea that Snape loves
> tormenting Harry so much that it would pain him
> to send the kid away amusing, I don't actually think
> that's what's going on.  I'm sure that Snape gets a 
> bit of a thrill in exercising his authority over Harry, but 
> I also think he justifies it to himself by saying that it's
> for the kid's own good--that Harry needs some strong
> guidelines and discipline.

Alla:

I have no doubt that Snape justifies everything he does in his mind.


Montavilla:
> So, I think Snape's *conscious* motivation is to be a
> good, strong teacher to Harry.  Unfortunately, he has
> this prejudice against Harry because of Harry's father and
> that really gets in the way.  So, Snape isn't as fair or
> objective as he would like to believe that he is.

Alla:

Yes.

Montavilla: 
> But, he's hardly the only teacher to view Harry through
> a James or Lily filter.  Many of Harry's teachers do so,
> notably Hagrid, McGonagall (who is probably thinking 
> a little about James's Quidditch prowess when she 
> pushes Harry onto the team), Flitwick (who *faints* when
> he sees Harry in his class for the first time), and Slughorn,
> who can't stop talking about Lily.

Alla:

He is the only teacher though to abuse Harry (IMO of course) because he views him from James' filter and while I agree about your examples to a degree, I think all other teachers get over James' filter pretty darn fast. It sure does not stop McGonagall from taking fifty points from Harry for example.

Montavilla:
> Hagrid also seems to view Draco through a Lucius 
> filter.  He's as rude to Draco in class as Snape is to
> Harry.  Snape may also be seeing Lucius in Draco,
> although I don't get that vibe as strongly as other 
> people seem to.
>

Alla:

Does he though? I thought Draco said enough rude things to Hagrid in order for Hagrid to view him as Draco and react the way he does.