[HPforGrownups] Harry's alleged debt to Dumbledore and Snape WAS: Re: Chapter Discussion

[June Ewing]

No: HPFGUIDX 190774




Alla:

I have to admit that the idea that Harry owes personal debt to *Dumbledore* of all people and Snape too shocked me so that I want to make a separate post out of it. Below is the list of possible reasons Why Harry may owe personal debt to Dumbledore and of course it is a bit sarcastic, but it is at the same time not really, it is just so very unbelievable to me because I can only list the wrongs Dumbledore did to Harry and nothing that Dumbledore did FOR Harry at all.

So, what does Harry owe Dumbledore a personal debt for? For subjecting him to a life time of abuse with Dursleys? For denying him the possibility of being raised by his Godfather whom his parents wanted to raise Harry? In other words for interfering and playing God with Harry's fate when nobody asked him to?

June:
None of this was Dumbledore's fault. Harry had to live with the Dursley's because of his mother's protection. He would be safe as long as he could call her sister's home, his home. I am sure that had Lily placed the spell on Harry the normal way she would have placed a spell that would keep him safe with someone she respected (ie Sirius or Dumbledore) but it was her love for Harry that made it so that he had to live with the Dursleys. As for Sirius, the whole wizarding world thought that he was a murder and that he had set up Harry's parents. Why would Dumbledore leave him with someone like that?

Alla:
I confess I am running out of reasons. Of course we know that Dumbledore during years and years failed to stop Voldemort, and did not even try to tell all the WW that Tommy Riddle and that mysterious Lord are one and the same and maybe that thing alone would have helped to start his downfall, but he found convenient sacrifice in poor Harry.

June:
On this point I agree with you. I have always wondered why Dumbledore never told anyone who Voldemort really was. I think if he had told everyone, there may have been someone who knew him well enough in school to know his weaknesses. However I do beleive some people did know, Slughorn for instance, but obviously some didn't. Hagrid I am sure would have said something if he knew who Voldemort really was. After all as teanagers Riddle framed Hagrid and got him expelled.

Alla:
Surely this is not the reason to feel indebted to him and surely Dumbledore did not contribute to mystery of Harry's surviving?

Now strangely as it sounds and disagree with it as I may, I at least see an argument for Harry owing personal debt to Snape, after all Snape did want him to live. Now, to me the fact that Snape wanted him to live in the name of his mother does not transform into Harry owing Snape a debt. In fact I think Snape owed Harry a huge debt which was born when Snape gave prophecy to Voldemort, and of course what Snape did to Harry on regular basis to me cancels any life saving debt Harry may have had, especially considering how vague and uncertain such debts are in WW.

However, however, having said that as I said, I can see good faith argument that Harry owes Snape a life saving debt, sure. Disagree with it but see the argument.

But Harry owing anything to *Dumbledore*? I think if Dumbledore would have stood in front of Harry on his knees for eternity he would have never paid the debt for life of pain and abuse he subjected Harry to and for death he wanted him to die.

June:
Personally I do not believe that Harry owes either of them a debt. Harry was "The Chosen One" These adults knew for years that Harry was the one who have to defeat Voldemort. I do believe that Dumbledore did love Harry but Harry was as much as a weapon against Voldemort as a cherished person in Dumbledore's life. I do not believe that Dumbledore was happy about this, but for the good of the many he had to prepare Harry for the time that he would have to kill Voldemort. As for Snape, I do not beleive he totally hated Harry. I think that Harry may have given Snape mixed emotions. I think one part of Snape liked Harry because he was Lily's son and one part of him disliked Harry because he was James' son. But both Dumbledore and Snape did their jobs (and personally I think in HBP what made Snape mad at Dumbledore was not that he had to help Harry but that Dumbledore had told him, if it came down to it he had to kill him (Dumbledore)). I think that Harry named his children after Dumbledore and Snape because he respected them (knowing now what Snape had sacrificed for him). I don't think it had anything to do with owing them a debt.








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