[the_old_crowd] Re: Dragons, Produced and Tickled, and Other Pleasantries

[susiequsie23]

Kneasy:
> Some of the others, well, might be worth reminding ourselves that  
> individuals are driven by more than just an attachment to 'ideals'.  
> The personal weighs heavy in the balance and is much closer to home. 

SSSusan:
Now, I know this isn't where you were going with this particular comment, but I'm takin' it and runnin' with it.  

I agree with this, and welcome someone else making the remark besides moi.  I'm a DDM!Snaper myself, and every time I present the possibility that Snape could be DDM! *by virtue of loyalty or attachment to DD,* as opposed to by virtue of a wholehearted belief in DD's ideals, I seem to be greeted with a great deal of incredulity from the OFH!Snapers.

I'm not suggesting that OFH!Snape is impossible, nor that ESE!Snape is impossible -- not at all.  But for now my read of HBP (and of canon) simply leaves me with a comfortable belief in the real possibility of DDM!Snape.  I doubt very much whether Severus Snape buys into Love-with-a-capital-L or into forgiveness and second chances, at least nowhere to the degree that DD does.  Still, he has been the beneficiary of those ideals, and some appreciation for them might have sunk in a tiny bit.  And even if they didn't sink in much... even if he doesn't give a rat's ass about the "ideals" of The Order... I still feel that it's possible that Snape has remained & will remain loyal to Dumbledore The Man.  I don't find it so hard to believe.  

Snape might well want Voldy killed off for his own *very* personal reasons (something I believe you ascribe to, Kneasy, though I'm guessing you'd place yourself most closely by the OFH!Snapers?), but that doesn't mean that he might can't be DDM! and not OFH!

To bring it back to more of the points *you* were trying to raise, Kneasy:

> There's a fair argument for the conclusion that DD is not averse to
> getting his hands dirty when he deems it necessary, or even when he
> finds it convenient. He could have ensured that GH never happened,
> he castigates himself for much of the misery in Harry's Muggle period,
> but it didn't stop him from forging Weapon!Harry as the key to his  
> plan. Nope, he's a pragmatist and that entails doing things you'd  
> rather not and if a few eggs get broken while making an omlette,  
> tough but so be it. 
<snip>
> High-minded morality is the preserve of post-facto commentators, it's  
> not a luxury that can be afforded by a leader who must win at all  
> costs, because there will be no second chance.

SSSusan:
Heh heh.  I suggest putting this out on TOL and seeing what happens.  Talk about people Taking Things Seriously.  I'm sick to death of the discussions of who's a child abuser and who's not, what constitutes abuse, how culpable was DD in Harry's abuse, and all of that.  I prefer the straightforward statement that "he's a pragmatist... it didn't stop him from forging Weapon!Harry" and the final statement of yours I quoted.  It's the truth, and it's the way it is, and I wish there'd stop being so much *judgment* of it Over There.

Whew.  Got *that* off my chest. :-)


Kneasy:
<snip discussion of Uncle Vernon's fairly understandable dislike & fear of magic vs. Jo's dislike of Uncle Vernon>
> Doubt whether herself would have much truck with such reasoning,  
> "deserves everything he gets" might be closer to the mark, but well,  
> I'm an old softy and can find sympathy for the most unlikely of  
> characters. 

SSSusan:
Snort!

Siriusly Snapey Susan, feeling better for having vented! 


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