[the_old_crowd] The Geist predicts again, mostly about Snape

[Amanda Geist]

Wow, I'm out of practice. I haven't been online at home for a couple of days
and it didn't even occur to me that I might have *replies.

Amanda:
> (6.a.) Harry will be unable to withstand Voldemort's mental abilities.

Pippin:
Harry's already shown he can banish Voldemort from his mind. I don't think
that's going to be undone. But Voldemort might demand that *Snape* use
legilimency on Harry, and that might be the mechanism whereby Harry realizes
that Snape is not on Voldemort's side. 

Amanda replies--Hey, my new Outlook doesn't put little carets in. What a
pain. I'll have to see if that's a setting or something.

Interesting thought, and likely, especially if Voldemort's been burned while
in Harry's mind before. Let Snape run the risks.  And it fills the criteria
of something Snape does that Harry can misinterpret. I mean, the boy didn't
credit that Snape had to play it in front of Umbridge; he certainly won't
give Snape the benefit in a much more highly charged situation.

> (8) Snape will die. 

Pippin:
Nah, he lives. There's that old "he's tough" rumor. But he really doesn't
fit the trajectory of a character who dies. He hasn't got a future, as you
say. But it's the characters *with* a future who get knocked off. Or at
least, the ones whom Harry expects to have a future. Cedric. Sirius. Even
Dumbledore, who was obviously going to get his ticket punched, was handed a
stack of unfinished business to leave behind him. 

Amanda replies: Good point; that's true. Okay, maybe not, but I'm not
totally convinced. It just "feels" right for him to die.

Pippin continues:
It doesn't quite fit the pattern of a redemptive death either. Characters
like that have some moment in their past when they should have chosen to
face their doom and dodged it by joining the Dark Side. "YOU SHOULD HAVE
DIED" bellows Sirius to Peter, and we know that Peter is going to
have to die in the end. Boromir couldn't face the loss of his city, Anakin
couldn't face losing Padme, and they have to redeem themselves by dying to
save the people they betrayed, or their  descendants.

Now, if Snape should have turned down the UV, or should have died on the
Tower rather than fulfill it, then he has such a moment. But otherwise he
doesn't, because according to Dumbledore, when Snape's big test came, the
moment when he should have died rather than co-operate with the murder of
James, Snape passed. He's *already* redeemed himself. 

Amanda replies: Can you clarify this? I don't follow. Redemptive character =
had a chance to choose good, which would have meant their doom, but didn't.
So will be toast later. You reference several. So. Snape = had chance to
choose good, but didn't. So he *won't* be toast later? I'm missing
something, because you don't make mistakes in logical parallels like that.

On to Kneasy.

> (3) We may see a third in the sequence of brilliant plot mechanisms that
> increase Harry and Snape's knowledge/understanding of each other without
> their desire to know and without them growing any closer. Snape and Harry
> have already been forced into a deeper understanding through the
Occlumency
> lessons and the old potions textbook. I can think of one plot device that
> will continue this-more knowledge of Lily and any interaction she had with
> Snape. Since both Snape and Harry see each other through eyes so
prejudiced
> they don't even realize it, this could lead to many interesting over- or
> mis-reactions.

Kneasy:
Um.  Not sure about this. Any understanding will come too late, IMO. Harry
is not about to give Sevvy the benefit of any doubts and Snape doesn't give
a toss what Harry thinks - he just wants him to fulfill the Prophecy in the
way that DD planned it. Not exactly fertile grounds for mutual respect or
understanding - and any hint that Sevvy saw Lily as a possible help-meet
through life's trials and
tribulations is liable to engender nothing but disgust in Harry.

Amanda replies:

No, you misunderstand. The whole point is that she's finding plot devices
that increase their knowledge of each other, *without* any concomitant
respect, increased benefit of the doubt, or lessening of dislike. I think
the characters, for plot reasons, are required to know a fair amount about
each other, but given their interaction, Rowling has had to find ways to
inform them without them growing any closer. I think she'll find a third way
(the first two were the Occlumency lessons, and the potions book). And my
thought was that the new way could involve some Lily backstory/association.

> (4) Related to #3: We will learn that he did love Lily...

Kneasy:
Hate LOLLIPOPS, just hate it. Not only is it mushy, it's also trite. So
it'll probably be true. Arrgh!

Amanda replies:

For the record-the acronym LOLLIPOPS postdates my espousing of this theory
on the old HP list. And "mushy" is in the eye of the beholder; and "trite"
depends on how it's handled.

Kneasy:

Snape's greatest feat may be saving Harry from himself (see (7)).

Amanda replies:

OOOOOOOOOh. I like that thought. Ooooooo. Mmmmm. Lots of potential there.
Kneasy, every so often you shine out like a shaft of gold when all around is
dark.

Kneasy:

What if, just for the sake of argument, ole Snapey really is a baddun.

Amanda replies:

His character will still be compelling. The "whys" will still be good
questions. Personally, I had found his character intriguing well before the
movie came out. I had "cast" that guy who played the Sheriff of Nottingham
(I didn't know Alan Rickman's name at the time) as the perfect Snape, so I
don't think my perceptions of the literary Snape were colored by the movie.
I think the movies did a good job of creating what I'd picked up from the
books.  But if someone came to the movies first? Good question.

My other way-before-the-movie-was-contemplated casting choice was Maggie
Smith for McGonagall, but I will forever condemn the movie makers for
casting anyone, anyone at all, other than Peter O'Toole for Dumbledore. He
would have been ideal. Maybe Michael Gambon will get tired, and we will see
the last of AgingHippie!Dumbledore, and Mr. O'Toole can make Dumbledore as
he should be.

~Amanda

 



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