[HPFGU-OTChatter] Re: The Four Loves

[Simon Nickerson]

I do not know Greek (except for the alphabet) although I have read 
Lewis' book, and a very fine book it is too. The following is from my 
recollection of the book.

In message <avs8p4+lhfo at eGroups.com>, "Melody <Malady579 at hotmail.com>" 
<Malady579 at hotmail.com> writes
>Anne wrote:
>> I believe your sense of what the four loves are is close but can be
>> defined a little more closely.  Look back at your previous post
>>where you looked up agape -- it was defined as "Christian love."  So
>>agape would be the love of God.  A person with agape would have love
>>for God and, by extension, for his people.  Mother Theresa's love for
>>the people of Calcutta is was agape love.  So is God's love for us.
>
>I think I am starting to unravel my confusion.  See - in my wrong view
>of things, God's love is more like Storge.  It is a parent's love.

I think storge is more general than that; it means 'affection'. It is 
certainly typified by a mother's love for her child (say), but this is 
not the only possible example.

>So
>when that love was introduced to me (about two weeks ago), I got
>confused.  You know: God the Father and all.  Plus to add to the fun,
>I got confused because if you say God's love is agape, well in
>Christian eyes that love will die for you.

Agape is the type of love that used to be embodied in the word 'charity' 
(Latin 'caritas'). These days, 'charity' often means simply giving alms, 
but it used to mean an unconditional love for the unlovely. It is a love 
manifested in actions rather than in emotions.

Coming back to what you said above, God's love for man in Christianity 
is definitely agape, not storge. It is more than simply a natural love, 
as storge is. It is a love for people who have done nothing to merit it 
or deserve it.

>Now I guess I see what the idea of agape really is.  Is it a love
>bestowed on a people because of their condition or rather their
>choice?  Is it, roughly, sympathetic love?

It doesn't have to be. It can be love bestowed despite conditions and 
choices. If Harry were to go up to Voldemort and tell him that he 
forgave him for all the harm he had done him, then this would be an act 
of agape.

>Can only Christians feel agape?

No, and Christians do not practice agape as much as they should! 
Christians are commanded to love their neighbour as themselves (Matthew 
22:39); the love here is agape-love.

>Anne disagreed:
>> Well, here I will disagree.  Eros is a form of love.  Lust, on the
>> other hand, is merely wanting sex and has nothing to do with love or
>> actually caring for the other person.  True eros is *partly*
>> expressed in sexual union as well as in other ways of caring, and
>> you can have eros, philos and agape for the same person.  And, yes,
>> I think someone could certainly die for someone out of eros alone.
>
>And now I see what I did.  I used the modern day word "erotic" to
>deduce what "eros" means.  I am sorry.  I completely agree with you.
>A person *can* have agape, eros, and philo on the same person.  In
>fact, I think that is what many people dream of.  To have the person
>you marry be the one person you can amass all these loves in one
>place.  I do think "storge" is the one odd love out as it should be.
>Woody Allen aside, it is not acceptable in our society to have four
>loves in one person.

Storge is not as specific as you think (see above); I think it would be 
quite possible to love somebody in all four ways. Indeed, to quote from 
Lewis' book:

"...But I must at once correct myself. I am talking of Affection 
[storge] as it is when it exists apart from the other loves. It often 
does so exist; often not. As gin is not only a drink in itself but also 
a base for many mixed drinks, so Affection, besides being a love itself, 
can enter into the other loves and colour them all through and become 
the very medium in which from day to day they operate. They would not 
perhaps wear very well without it... As for erotic love, I can imagine 
nothing more disagreeable than to experience it for more than a very 
short time without this homespun clothing of affection. That would be a 
most uneasy condition, either too angelic or too animal or each by turn; 
never quite great enough or little enough for man."

-- 
Simon Nickerson
"I went on the Underground - "
"Really?" said Mr Weasley eagerly. "Were there escapators?"