Theory Bay: Ouroboros in HP? (Pretty long!)

[say543]

No: HPFGUIDX 78486

> KathyK:
> I think that Voldemort's taking Trelawney's partial prophecy to heart 
> (or whatever he has in its place) can be explained much more simply 
> than that.  The eavesdropper tells Voldemort the part of the prophecy 
> that he overheard.  Voldemort loves power and fears death.  
> 
> Upon hearing that there is someone out there with the potential to 
> destroy or even kill him, he does everything he can to ensure that 
> this child will not succeed.  So he goes after Harry.  Simple, and it 
> doesn't involve all the headaches that time travel and extra 
> prophecies create.  The prophecy we have now is ambiguous enough 
> without throwing more into the mix, I believe.
> 
> Besides, we don't know the eavesdropper or Voldemort knows anything 
> about Trelawney.  How would they know she was a fraud?  And even if 
> they did find out, I don't think it would matter because Voldemort's 
> fear of death runs deep and he wouldn't take any chances with a 
> prophecy.  
> **********

hesdead-dealwithit:

Theory doesn't HAVE to be the reason LV paid attention to Trelawney.
It's just that it is an interesting byproduct of the theory that he
WOULD listen to it undoubtedly.

> KathyK:
> Just an irrelevant question, but why wouldn't Harry be good at memory 
> charms?  And how do we know Lockhart's memory would come back at all 
> if he'd had a proper wand at the time rather than Ron's busted one? 
> Of course, Ron and Harry would be the ones in St Mungo's, but you 
> know what I mean.  Look at Bertha Jorkins.  Crouch Sr. put such a 
> strong memory charm on her that it permanently damaged her memory 
> even though he was only out to destroy one memory.  And Voldemort and 
> Wormtail were only able to get at her missing memory by destroying 
> the woman.
> **********

hesdead-dealwithit
It seems to me that Ron's wand only resulted in the spell firing
backward, not being weakened. And if it wasn't weakened, the fact that
the memory came back after being obliviated by one of the most
experienced users of the memory charm is pretty revealing. Also,
Crouch's charm did not damage her memory - she was forgetful before
that. Only when LV extracted the memory from her, it resulted in her
being destroyed  and useless - but not killed. There is no reason that
before LV got to her her memory wouldn't have started to come back
from what Crouch charmed her about.

> **********
> KathyK:
> I love stories about time travel.  It's just the logistics of it that 
> give me a headache, making me think in circles.  Like this, for 
> instance.  Lord Voldemort reads anti-muggle "prophecies" in the 
> normal HP timeline that are attributed to Salazar Slytherin.  In the 
> meantime, he uses these prophecies to go after Harry when he hears 
> Trelwaney's own prophecy about him.  
> 
> In the final battle, Harry obliviates him, or doesn't, and somehow 
> sends him back 1000 years to the time of the Hogwarts founders where 
> he becomes Salazar Slytherin.  As Slytherin, he writes 
> the "prophecies" that he himself read in the far future (but in his 
> own past).  I'm with you so far.  He does this in an attempt to help 
> himself to kill Harry before Harry has a chance to vanquish him like 
> it says in Trelwaney's prophecy.
> 
> And this is where I get completely lost and befuddled.  Feel free to 
> explain it to me.  If Voldemort knows he's just going to end up back 
> in the past, why does he write the "prophecies" at all?  Why can't he 
> change what he writes to say, "Don't kill the baby, wait until he's 
> older," or something similar?
> 
> I know, I know, they've already been written so they cannot be 
> changed.  But I just don't get it.  How does he think writing the 
> exact same thing will help him in the future?  Why can't he write 
> something different?  Does he think the future Voldemort will 
> interpret Slytherin's writing differently and be able to change the 
> future/past?  If he didn't change his fate, what makes him think his 
> next self will?
> **********

hesdead-dealwithit:
LV/Slytherin CANNOT change what he wants to write. The prophecies have
been written and cannot be changed. Plus, since his memory was
destroyed, he has only regained a partial account of what happened to
him. So maybe he could tell LV not to kill the boy, and to wait, but
since LV came back anyway, it wouldn't matter. Slytherin would write
everything that he could remember that could be useful to LV,
including the fact that if LV killed Harry, the timeline would be
broken and LV could not be vanquished by anyone else. He would become
invincible.

> >>>If Harry was dead, the only one that could vanquish the Dark Lord 
> is gone, and LV would live forever.<<<
> 
> **********
> KathyK:
> Why can't he live forever beginning from Slytherin's time?  He hasn't 
> got Harry around to make life difficult.  Or is it, as you say a 
> little later, that he ceases to be Lord Voldemort because he's gone 
> to a different time an assumed a different name.  In that case, do we 
> think Salazar Slytherin is still alive somewhere in Harry's time?  
> Could he have taught himself some of the deep, dark, magic Voldemort 
> learns?  

hesdead-dealwithit
No. Once LV becomes Slytherin, he is no longer the Dark Lord that
Trelawney mentions. He will die at a normal time. But yes, he could
teach himself some of the dark deep magic that LV learns, and he would
put it in the prophecies for LV to come across. 

> Your theory is interesting, I just have a hard time wrapping my mind 
> around it.

Just to set the record straight, because I don't want to take credit
for what is not mine, this theory is not mine but was created by Auri
de Mir on cosforums.com (Spoiler>Predictions and Theories>Ouroboros).
Any other thoughts on this theory?

hesdead-dealwithit