Sorting Hat, House Affiliations

[jodel at aol.com]

No: HPFGUIDX 60741

This is actually a cross-post from another list where the question was raised 
on what Lavendar Brown and Parvati Patil were doing in Gryffindor. In the 
course of the discussion the old moldy fig of what Neville was doing in 
Gryffindor was also raised and someone threw in the fairly new notion that it might 
just be "glorious Gryffindor" rather than "humble Hufflepuff" which serves as the 
"default" house that catches the kids that don't clearly fit in anywhere 
else. 
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"Oh, I suspect there is probably a fine tradition of heedless Gryffindor 
airheads that Lavendar and Parvati fit right into. Why else would the Slyths (and 
possibly others) be so disparaging toward the Gryffs in general? Some kinds of 
foolishness and what ends up counting as a "form" of bravery seem to go hand 
in hand.

Brown & Patil aren't total cowards at any rate. They may squeal like little 
piggies with or without good reason but we don't see them running for cover. 
Nor do they avoid behavior which they *know* will get them into trouble if 
caught. At this point much of their poor showing is because we only see them from 
Harry's PoV, and Harry, at this stage of his life, is mostly seeeing females 
through the Weasley-patented "macho dude" filter. Only Hermione has really been 
able to make herself visible *as an individual* through that filter, to date, 
and she got past it only through a fluke with the Troll in the bathroom 
incident.

The idea that it may be Gryffindor which serves as the "default" house is not 
a bad one. The "default" is certainly not Hufflepuff, whose requirements 
demand a degree of willing self-effacement that is not at all common in 
adolescents. The off-in-their-own-little-world types, like Neville do much better when 
thrown to the lions than the badgers, who tend to regard non-partcipation in 
the light of a mortal sin. 

I also suspect that the Ravenclaws are not necessarily the top academic 
achievers, but the ones who admire cleverness and "individuality" to the point of 
exaggeration, even if they do not personally posess those qualities to any 
great degree. (But they will certainly go to almost any length to make you think 
so. Cutting off one's nose to spite one's face has been refined into an art 
form in Ravenclaw) . They are the Hufflepuffs' "opposite number" in that regard 
and I suspect that the classes that pair them are every bit as stressful as the 
Gryff/Slyth configurations. 

My own take on the matter is that the consideration that the Hat uses as the 
main criterion on sorting the students (who as adolescents, or pre-adolescents 
are hardly "fully-formed" personalities yet) are the child's own wishes and 
values. Draco and Hermione both were mentally shouting their choices to the Hat 
even as they put it on and the Hat complied immediately. There was no 
discussion period over whether Hermione might have been better suited in Ravenclaw 
(which she very well might have). She wanted Gryffindor, she got Gryffindor, the 
Hat didn't care. In the cases where the child has no deffinite expectations 
it will discuss the matter with them as it did with Harry. Once the Hat 
recognizes what the child deems important, it sends them to where they are most 
likely to achieve their goals. Every sorting song we've had to date tends to 
support this reading.

The students who are determined to make theirs' a "great sucess story" land 
in Slytherin. Draco Malfoy has been brought up to have no doubt that this is 
his destiny. Nor is this a difficult attitude to apply to even such unpromising 
examples as Crabbe and Goyle. Slytherin teaches its children how to "win". 
Regardless of means, regardless of result.

Those who want to be "widely, acclaimed or *personally* admired" land in 
Gryffindor. Misses Brown & Patil, anyone? Hermione? To the Gryffs, mere "winning" 
is not enough. They must do so in a manner that ensures that they will 
(eventually) be "admired" for it. Which holds them to a particular standard of 
behavior. (The Slyths don't care if they win and are disliked for it afterwards, the 
'Claws don't care whether they're disliked, period. The 'Puffs would rather 
be liked and valued than to win and be disliked.) Not that the virtuous manner 
necessarily goes beyond skin deep. It is very easy to see both Ludo Bagman and 
Gilderoy Lockhart into Gryffindor.

Note: you will easily recognize that both of the above represent two only 
slightly contrasting forms of standard "leadership" roles. As is, in it's own 
somewhat more solitary way, the following;

Those who want to be "*right* -- at whatever cost" end up in Ravenclaw. I 
suspect that the Patil twins were squabblers rather than the kind of "double act" 
that Fred and George represent. I also suspect that an awful lot of 
traditional Ravenclaw "leaders" are perfectly satisfied with a following of one. This 
is the house of the "different drummer". And they tend to be agressive with it. 
Cho Chang notwithstanding, I doubt that consideration for the feelings of 
others is a widely held Ravenclaw trait. In fact, there is much more likely to be 
a pronounced tendency to call a spade a bloody shovel in the most wittily 
harsh manner possible among the eaglets. 

And those who want to "belong" and to be "deeply valued" are the Hufflepuffs. 
Neville knows that he belongs and is valued by his family, and it has become 
more of a burden than anything else. He would not have been looking for the 
more of the same at Hogwarts. According to my Longbottom theory, the Hat's 
difficulty was to get Neville resigned to going into *any* house at all, and 
Gryffindor was the one most likely to accept him without arguement or unpleasant 
repercusions.

It will also be noticed that to "belong" and to "succeed" are not so widely 
removed from each other after all, thus closing the circle. In fact, each of 
the signature goals of the four Houses shows some relationship with that of at 
least one of the others, with some critical difference in emphsis and 
interpretation. For example; Ravenclaw's determination to be "right" is, if anything, 
even more ruthless than Slytherin's determination to "succeed" but to attain 
that goal will often cancel out any possibility of worldly success. Thus the 
major distinction between the Slyths and the 'Claws. (I doubt Snape looks forward 
to teaching Ravenclaws. They *argue* with him.)

Neville also has a larger share of "social" courage than either Ron OR Harry 
do *at this point* in their development. Courage doesn't mean that you go 
*looking* for dangerous situations to throw yourself into, after all. Harry's are 
largely forced on him. No one has chosen to force such a situation onto 
Neville -- yet.

-JOdel