OOP Family tree and Arthur (Was: Re: FAMILY TREE AND MOLLY WEASLEY)

[bowlwoman]

No: HPFGUIDX 66080

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "Liz Sager" <ChaserChick at h...> 
wrote:
> What I don't understand is the 'second cousin, once removed' 
business. What 
> does it mean if a relative is 'once removed'? I've heard several 
references 
> to this in my family (as I have a large extended family), but 
whenever I ask 
> what it means, I never get a straight answer. Since Arthur is 
Sirius's 
> second cousin, once removed, what exactly is the relation?

My mom has done geneaology for 30 years, so I know this stuff like 
the back of my hand.  

I'm going off-topic for a bit, but I'll bring it back toward the end, 
I promise.  

First, I'm going to draw a little chart to help explain and I'm 
making up some names.  For simplicity, I'm also leaving off most of 
the Weasley children and just using Ron for my example.

I've had to delete and resend this post because the chart was messed 
up. I also had to post with dots between words and do it left margin 
flush to get it to post correctly.  If you want a better chart, email 
me and I can send it in a Word doc.



Phineas
|
|
------------------------
|......................|
|......................|
William................Charles
|..................... |
|......................|
---....................------------
|......................|...........|
|......................|...........|
Elizabeth..............Andrew......Margaret
|......................| 
|......................| 
---....................---
|......................|
|......................|
Edward.................Arthur
|......................| 
|......................|
------------...........--- 
|..........|...........|
|..........|...........|
Sirius.....Regulus.....Ron


In this scenario, Phineas is the patriarch.  William and Charles are 
brothers with Elizabeth being first cousins to Andrew and Margaret.  
You can tell that they are in the same generation because they are on 
a horizontal line in the family tree..  Edward and Arthur are second 
cousins, by the same reasoning.

Now, if a relative is a "generation removed", that means that they 
are a diagonal relation on the geneaology chart.  Sirus is Edward's 
son.  That means that since Arthur is a direct second cousin to 
Edward, Edward's son is one generation removed from that 
relationship, hence Arthur's second cousin once removed.  If Sirius 
had children, those kids would be Arthur's second cousins twice 
removed.   Ron and  Sirius are third cousins.

To determine the relationship, you always find the uppermost 
relationship that will give a horizontal generation for ONE of the 
participants (i.e. Edward and Arthur are on the horizontal, so you 
use that for the basis of the degree of cousins) then you count down 
the number of generations you have to go until you find the other  
person.  Just to practice, we can determine Margaret and Sirius' 
relationship.  They are first cousins twice removed. Margaret is the 
relative the highest on the chart, so you use her relationship to the 
chart (first cousin) then count down 2 generations to Sirus.  

So, what does this mean in the Potterverse?  Well, Arthur and Sirius 
had a relative in common WAY back who would be Arthur's great-
grandfather and Sirius' great-great-grandfather.  Sirius mentions 
that Phineas Nigellus is his great-great-grandfather.  Even though 
Sirius would have 16 great-great grandfathers, the fact that JKR 
mentioned both Phineas' relationship to Sirius and the Sirius/Arthur 
relationship makes me wonder if Phineas isn't the common ancestor.  
That would make Phineas Arthur's great-grandfather as well.  This 
might also help explain all the Weasley boys being prefects/HB and 
maybe Phineas will prove to play a bigger role with Ron or Ginny in 
the future.

bowlwoman