Harry v. Tom (was: LV never loved anyone)

[delwynmarch]

No: HPFGUIDX 110644

Valky wrote :
"For you, as you have said however, the entity did make manifest in 
your husband, he gave you the choice and you made it. Had you rejected
it and were outside now looking in at yourself how would you feel
about your blame for giving up your chance. 

Now juxtapose that Tom Riddle was given to manifest the same 
opportunity but chose against. It would be hard to maintain that he 
was entirely blameless for his continued condition. "

Del replies :
I don't know. As I said in another post, I'm not sure I would have
even listened if someone had told me I was depressed, back when I was
a teenager. I was convinced that I was different, not sick. I thought
I should change myself, not cure myself. So I really doubt I would
have been open to anyone telling me that this or that negative thing
was not really from me but from my illness. I would not have seen the
light like I did years later, because I wasn't *ready* to see it. I
first had to recognise that I was ill, that there was a monster in my
head that warped my feelings and thinking, before I was able to accept
that I *could* separate myself from that monster. 

Similarly, I don't know if Tom, as a kid or a teenager, was ready to
hear that he had a personality disorder and what he could do about it.
Even if someone had told him that his behaviour was straight out of a
textbook, I doubt he would have accepted this diagnosis. It's not a
matter of choice, it's a matter of being able to look at yourself
critically. And from what we see in CoS, Tom had no problem with who
he was and what he did.

Thanks for rephrasing what you meant about observers and blame, it
makes much more sense now.

Valky wrote :
"In the case of Tom Riddle, as with anyone, he lives with his 
conscience alone in his secret, silent to outsiders, place inside. He
chooses not to be dependent on others clarity even at the tender age
of 16."

Del replies :
First of all, if Tom is indeed a sociopath, then he doesn't have a
conscience "as with anyone".
Second, why should he choose to depend on anyone else if a) he doesn't
realise there's anything wrong with him, and b) he thinks other people
don't understand him ?
After all, while kids are usually quite willing to trust adults,
teenagers on the other hand have a strong tendency to believe that
nobody understands them and that nobody has ever been through their
problems. If that teenager is a sociopath on top of it, it's not
surprising at all that he shouldn't even stop to wonder if maybe, just
maybe, the person talking to them might be right.

Valky wrote :
"Again it *not* my belief that this automatically means he is not 
affected by his past suffering, but it is a choice that he can freely
make in moving toward a better existence in spite of his suffering."

Del replies :
But he *was* moving towards a better existence, in his eyes at least !
He *was* taking steps to reach his goals. He had his own idea of what
he wanted to become, and he was *actively* working towards it. He was
indeed *choosing* his future. But if he was a sociopath, then he
wasn't aware that this future would not be morally satisfying and that
the steps he was taking on the way were morally wrong.

His idea and society's idea of a better life were so widely different
that he couldn't even try to begin why he should go another way.

Nash's story as you summarised it presents a very interesting parallel
to Sociopath!Tom's story, indeed. Both were highly dysfunctional from
a very young age, unable to understand that their world was not the
real world. But there seems to be a huge difference : love. Nash was
able to love, and ultimately made his choice based on it.
Sociopath!Tom, on the other hand, never loved, and couldn't base his
decisions on that, so he had to base them on something else.

Moreover, Nash apparently realised at some time that he was ill. We
have no idea if LV ever came to that same conclusion. If he didn't,
then he's still living in his own world and believing this is the real
world.

Valky wrote :
"But love is everywhere and it does find you."

Del replies :
Could be, but maybe it hasn't found LV *yet* ? After all, once he left
school, he wasn't exactly in the right kind of environment for love to
find him, was he ? But now that the link between him and Harry is
getting stronger, maybe love will finally find him, through Harry.

Del