Dumbledore's pleading/What Horcruxes Dumbledore and Harry destroyed?

[pippin_999]

No: HPFGUIDX 141506

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "nrenka" <nrenka at y...> wrote:
>

> 
> Given the superpowers of love magic in the Potterverse, does Harry 
> need to learn how to close his mind, to shut himself off--or could 
> our final solution involve the emotions primary over the intellect, 
> opening up to somehow conquer?
> 
> I surmise that the twisty-turny part of the fandom doesn't much like 
> the idea of JKR elevating emotion above intellectual solutions, but I 
> can see precedents for it.

Pippin:
Oh, I'm sure it will be something like that. But Harry still has to 
survive Voldemort's efforts to kill him, and he's never done that without
help of some kind.

Pippin (previously)
> > If JKR made him sound weak merely to make his death more pathetic, 
> > it would be a betrayal, IMO, far more grievous than any treachery 
> > in her books.

Nora: 
> What kind of betrayal--a thematic one?  That depends on what theme is 
> actually going to be pulled out as the correct (by which I mean most 
> supported, the implications which are actually realized) one.  After 
> all, JKR has True Edge, if I remember correctly.  She wouldn't be 
> above hitting us with some genuine pathos.  Your ESE!Lupin theory 
> does that, it just displaces it onto another character.  What a nice 
> way to get Sevvykins out of a deep moral quandry. :)
> 

Pippin:
I think the theme of accepting death straight backed and proud is 
well established--it would take some pretty intense backtracking to
undermine it now. Genuine pathos in Dumbledore, yes, betrayed
by someone he trusted, yes indeed, but not that he expected others to 
confront  death and evil bravely but didn't do so himself. JKR's
epitome of goodness, a hypocrite? I don't think so!  I can't see
him pleading with an enemy, only asking one last favor from a friend.

 But I wasn't referring to anything so lofty. I meant the expectations of 
the reader who has been presented with a mystery. It is one thing to have 
Mark Evans or Alice's gum wrappers turn out to be nothing much -- 
but when a major character sets us a puzzle, I expect it to be solved. 


JKR went out of her way to establish that several things about Dumbledore's 
death were unusual, not least that unexplained plea. She constantly refers to 
hints, red herrings, and that there is something unexpected coming. After 
all that, I would feel betrayed if there is nothing in Book Seven but Harry 
conquering Voldemort, Snape dying in a corner, forgiven or otherwise, and
nothing further explained.

Pippin