Snape 's story to Bella in Spinner's End WAS:Re: Snape and the blah-blah......

[spotsgal]

No: HPFGUIDX 141990

> Alla:
> I am talking about whether Snape was telling the truth in general in 
> his story to Bella. Now as you probably know I think that the 
> interpretation that everything that he WAS talking about was  the 
> truth has at least an equal support to "Snape's lying to Bella" 
> intepretation.
> 
<snip>
> So, after rereading the chapter, it does not seem to me that this is 
> what Snape is saying. Here is what he is saying:
> 
> I am pleased to say, however, that Dumbledore is growing old. The 
> Duel with the Dark Lord last month shook him. He has since sustained
> a serious injury because his reactions are slower than they once 
> were. But through all these years, he has never stopped  trusting 
> Severus Snape, and therein lies my great value to the Dark Lord. - 
> p.31
> 
> 
> Am I missing something here? Is there something in this quote that 
> we know for sure to be a lie?

Christina:

I see this as, not quite a lie, but an exaggeration.  Do we have any
evidence that Dumbledore was injured by the ring because of poor
reflexes?  Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems to me that injury
could not have been avoided in Dumbledore's handling of the ring.

> Alla:
> Snape does not specify WHERE Dumbledore sustained such injury, but 
> it could be because he himself has no clue, right? I think 
> Dumbledore could have asked Snape to heal him without specifying 
> what caused the injury.

Christina:

I suppose so, but I find it unlikely.  Whether Snape is on
Dumbledore's side or not, Dumbledore trusts him completely, and I
don't see why he would ask him to heal his injury without telling him
what it was from.


> Alla:
> I don't see where Snape lies in this quote, he may omit things, 
> sure, but lying? I don't know about that.

Christina:

Well, I can tell you what I personally find strange.  It has always
bothered me that he took credit for Sirius's death.  I just don't see
how he could have helped bring that about.  Harry might blame Snape
for goading Sirius concerning his confinement in 12GP, but there is
*no way* Sirius was going to stay indoors when Harry was in danger, no
matter what Snape or anyone might have done/said to him.

I've also expressed some concern about the foe-glass moment in GoF
(first addressed in message #136806).  This is not 100% prove that
Snape lied to Bellatrix, but it some heavy evidence.  Snape sees
himself in Fake!Moody's foe-glass at the end of GoF.  All of the
evidence suggests that the glass shows the foes of the owner
(Fake!Moody), and shows one's true enemies, not their perceived
enemies.  Now, barring some kind of cheesy explanation (ie, all the
Death Eaters are Fake!Moody's foes because they are not helping LV
rise again), this shows that Snape was DD!Man at the end of GoF.  Now,
while this says *nothing* about his loyalties during HBP, it *does*
show that he must have lied to Bella here:

(HBP, pg 28)
"...by allowing Dumbledore to think that I was only returning to the
Dark Lord's side because I was ordered to, I have been able to pass
information on Dumbledore and the Order of the Phoenix ever since!
Consider, Bellatrix: The Dark Mark had been growing stronger for
months. I knew he must be about to return, all the Death Eaters knew!
I had plenty of time to think about what I wanted to do, to plan my
next move, to escape like Karkaroff, didn't I?"

Basically, Snape is saying that he delayed returning to Voldemort so
that he could continue helping the Dark Lord as his spy.  Also, he is
saying that he had planned this move out in advance, since the burning
of his Mark signalled him to LV's return.  But if Snape was on the
side of the Order at the end of GoF, then this is an outright lie.

I also think Snape's claim that Dumbledore wouldn't give him the DADA
job because it might "tempt him him into his old ways," is ridiculous,
for reasons that have been brought up on this list many times.  This
idea is particularly validated by the information we now know about
the *real* DADA curse.

This is of course, all my opinion, but even if Snape does turn out to
be ESE!, I still find it difficult to believe that everything he said
to Bella was true.  No matter where his allegiances lie, I doubt he
tells the whole truth to anyone.

...And lying by omission is still lying, isn't it?

Christina