Why are Dobby and Grawp so annoying?/ Dumbledore's plans in HBP LONG

[pippin_999]

No: HPFGUIDX 162290

 
> Alla:
> 
> Huh? Oh, I suppose if we will take the assumption of Snape's good 
> intentions as canon, then I can see your analogy somehow. Dobby's 
> good intentions **are** canon though, Snape's are not IMO.

Pippin:
Dobby's good intentions didn't become unambiguous until 
**after** he'd almost gotten Harry expelled, launched the 
flying car fiasco, and broken Harry's arm. Canon suggested
that he might be acting on Lucius or Draco's orders.

> Pippin:
> > As far as Harry knows, Firenze and Lupin haven't injured him in any
> > significant way. Dobby has. 
> 
> Alla:
> 
> Well, yeah, they did not injur Harry. As far as I remember, it 
> should read they did not injure Harry, period. Do you know something 
> none of us knows, Pippin? :)

Pippin:
I think we all know that the dementors injured Harry. Lupin
is partly responsible for that at the very least because he 
withheld information that he himself thought might have
helped to capture Sirius, making the dementor guard 
unnecessary. 

> 
> Pippin:
> > Finally, it's hard to identify with Dobby because, like Snape, 
> we're
> > not sure what to make of his attitude. We don't
> > debate whether the centaurs or werewolves have human feelings,
> > but we're not so sure about House Elves, and we're not so
> > sure about Snape.
> 
> Alla:

> Oh, and I guess if we were to compare them after all Dobby wins, 
> because as Sherry said in GoF and another books Dobby does help 
> without hurting Harry, something which Snape is else to demonstrate 
> ( that is if he was doing things to help in the first place)

Pippin:
Huh? How did Snape saving Harry from Quirrell's curse hurt him?

> > 
> > Pippin:
> > I see you've forgotten that he saved Harry from whatever curse
> > Lucius meant to put on him at the end of CoS.
> 
> 
> Alla:
> 
> I forgot  that Lucius start the curse in the book, I thought that 
> was in the movie only. I thought that in the book Lucius advances at 
> Harry,  but does not curse him yet? 

Pippin:
'Then [Mr. Malfoy] lunged at Harry.

"You've lost me my servant, boy!"

But Dobby shouted, "You shall not harm Harry Potter!"
There was a loud bang and Mr. Malfoy was thrown backwards.
He crashed down the stairs, three at a time, landing in a crumpled
heap on the landing below. He got up, his face livid, and
pulled out his wand,but Dobby raised a long, threatening 
finger. 

"You shall go now," he said fiercely, pointing down at
Mr. Malfoy.

"You shall not touch Harry Potter. You shall go now."
---
So he advances on Harry, is thrown back, and then
draws his wand. 

> > Pippin:
> > But that *is* the fight against Voldemort. 
> 
> Alla:
> 
> You mean dying for Draco Malfoy being able to have a revelation? 
> Sorry, not my interpretation at all.

Pippin:
Um, no, dying so that Draco, and everyone else in the WW,
can have   a choice besides the one that Voldemort 
offers: Be one of my killers or die. 

> Alla:
> 
> And did anybody ask Ron and Katie whether they wish to give up their 
> lives in order for Malfoy to understand that signing up for killing 
> Headmaster is a stupid thing to do?

Pippin:
They were at the closing feast in GoF, no?

They were told that they needed to unite in friendship 
and trust or Voldemort would defeat them, and that the choice 
that was before Cedric might come before them. That doing 
what was right instead of what was easy might mean that 
they would die. 

Dumbledore's counsel, like the counsel of Gandalf, was not 
based on foreknowledge of safety for himself or for others. It was
based on the idea that some things are worth dying for.


Pippin