What Hermione thinks of Snape as a teacher (LONG)/ a bit of Hermione andTrelawne

[dumbledore11214]

No: HPFGUIDX 148018

 
> Magpie:
<SNIP>
  This issue is not as complicated as 
> it's being made.  Yes, Hermione likes Lupin as a teacher and does 
not defend 
> Snape's every action in the class.  That's not the point.  The 
point is that 
> Snape has a certain level of competence that is a given and that 
is not 
> questioned by any student, including Hermione.  They complain 
about things 
> he does in class, they complain about things in his class.  But 
neither 
> Hermione nor anyone else doubts Snape the way certain other 
teachers are 
> doubted (though people fight the text on that too).

Alla:

Well, actually my initial point was specifically trying to rebute 
the argument that Hermione DEFENDS Snape as a teacher through the 
books. The argument was being made many times that Hermione's 
support of Snape  should be seen as evidence (not exclusive, but 
one of the proofs) that he is good teacher. I am not saying that 
Snape does not have a certain level of competence, I said that he 
KNOWS his subjects. What I AM saying is that the argument as it was 
made in the past(not what you argue now, I am not even saying that 
you made this argument) - that Hermione DEFENSE of Snape can be used 
as proof of him being a good teacher has no canon support in my view.

I spend several hours yesterday  looking through five books (HAHA, 
yes, I have other things to do too) granted I did not look carefully 
through HBP, because it was too late by that time and failed to 
locate a quote which would support Hermione defending Snape as a 
teacher.

Hermione defends his loyalty to Dumbledore, that she does, but 
defending Snape as a teacher, not that I could see.

Of course, your argument is valid that JKR does not have book page 
or that we can infer that Hermione thinks Snape is Okay, etc.

All that I am saying that now I am pretty sure that the argument of 
Hermione specifically defending Snape is weak at best and possibly 
not even substantiated at all. Of course I could have missed 
something.

I am not comparing Snape with any other teachers right now, I just 
see no proof in the books that Hermione thinks BETTER of Snape than 
any other teachers excluding Trelawney and Hagrid and in the case of 
Trelawney, I am getting more and more convinced that it has more to 
do with subject than with the teacher and I am NOT calling Trelawney 
a good teacher either, I just think that Hermione calling her an old 
fraud may not be substantiated at the end either.


Magpie:
> No, Hermione probably would not have liked Divination no matter 
who was 
> teaching it, but yes, she probably would have shown respect for 
Firenze that 
> she does not show for Trelawney because Trelawney is a fraud.  

Alla:

She calls Firenze a "horse". I don't see it as proof of respect, 
quite the contrary.

Magpie:
Sometimes she 
> makes real predictions and is not being a fraud, but in her class 
she makes 
> predictions that are blatantly untrue, sometimes in order to 
> passive-aggressively insult people and Harry and Ron submit 
homework that's 
> completely made up.

Alla:

It had been argued that what Trelawney "sees" is actually true for 
the most part, but she misinterprets what she 'sees". If that is 
true, I don't think that she is a fraud. She just lacks Seer's 
talent to correctly interpret her predictions.


Magpie:
  She sometimes gets emotional in class and takes it out 
> on students, iirc. 

Alla:

That she does of course, that is why I don't call her a good teacher.


Magpie:
 I think Hermione would probably lack respect for 
> Trelawney no matter what she was teaching.

Alla:

On that I am having big doubts. I think that if Trelawney was 
teaching something Hermione had more faith in, Hermione would have 
had very little problems with her as a teacher. But I am just 
speculating of course.

Hermione was able to tolerate Professor Binns teaching after all.


Magpie: 
 Snape definitely has problems as a teacher, which Rowling has even 
> spelled out in interviews: when he's picking on kids and abusing 
his power, 
> the kids see through him.  When Snape is picking on Harry, he is 
not being a 
> teacher.
<SNIP>

Alla:

You mean Snape not being a teacher when he picks on Harry in 
metaphorical sense? If so I agree, but if you mean that he only 
picks on Harry during the time he is not teaching, I disagree.

JMO,

Alla