Snape Loved or In-Love with Lily?

[justcarol67]

No: HPFGUIDX 148430

<big snip>
> Alla, who unfortunately is unable to talk herself out of Snape/Lily 
> anymore.
>
Carol responds:
All right, let's try to talk you out of this one!

First, we know that Snape was already teaching at Hogwarts when Peter
Pettigrew became Secret Keeper and was still teaching there (of
course) one week later when the Potters were killed. (I can produce
the evidence, which includes his words to Bellatrix and to Umbridge,
if you need it.) How could he have known where the Potters were
without Pettigrew telling him, and how could he have left Hogwarts
(from which you can't Disapparate) without Dumbledore knowing?

Second, where is the actual evidence of any love for Lily, setting
aside the supposed need for this theory to explain Snape's remorse?

Third, we know that Peter Pettigrew was at Godric's Hollow because he
later returned Voldemort's wand. Where is the evidence that anyone
else was there?

Fourth, JKR concedes that Voldemort "offered" to let Lily live, but
what *canon* evidence do we have that this "offer" (a word that JKR
picks up from the person who asked the question)
 
http://www.quick-quote-quill.org/articles/2005/0705-tlc_mugglenet-anelli-1.htm

consists of anything beyond "Stand aside, girl"?

Harry himself thinks otherwise:

"'He told her to get out of the way,' said Harry remorselessly [to
Slughorn]. 'He told me she needn't have died. He only wanted me. She
could have run' (HBP Am. ed. 489).

Although Harry is basing his information on the words of his mother's
murderer in the graveyard scene, this interpretation is supported by
what he hears when the Dementors attack him in PoA.

No other person present (except PP hiding in rat form); no ulterior
motive on Voldemort's part; no indication that he is acting to reward
a loyal accomplice or save Lily's life for any reason except that he
doesn't care about her. His business, as Harry states, is with baby
Harry alone--the Prophecy boy whose death he thinks will insure his
immortality.

It seems to me that any other explanation of Voldemort's motives in
telling Lily to stand aside (as he tells the boy Hagrid to stand aside
in CoS) is speculation to fill a perceived plot hole. But canon--at
least the canon we have so far--indicates otherwise.

So counting the words "stand aside" as the "offer" referred to in the
interview question, do we really need a motive here other than the
clear and obvious one that Harry states?

However confused Harry may be with regard to Snape, his grasp of
*Voldemort's* character and motives is pretty firm, and I see no
reason to question his accuracy here.

To sum up:

If we accept for the sake of argument that Voldemort's "offer"
consists of providing Lily the opportunity to run away and save
herself at the expense of her son's life (in keeping with his contempt
for mothers and his consistent underestimation of love), there's no
need for Snape or anyone other than Voldemort and Wormtail to be
present at Godric's Hollow. There's still less need for Voldemort to
offer Lily to Snape as some sort of prize. (Are we reading in
Wormtongue and Eowyn here? what evidence do we have that LV held
22-year-old Snape in such high regard?) And there's no need to explain
how Snape could know that the Potters were at Godric's Hollow, which
only Pettigrew could have told him, or how he could get there from
Hogwarts on the night of the murders without arousing suspicion when
you can't Apparate from Hogwarts.

It's much simpler and less messy if Snape is not involved, at least
not until he feels a change in his Dark Mark and informs Dumbledore,
which would not involve anything more complicated than running
upstairs to the headmaster's office.


Carol, agreeing with Alla that "Snape loves Lily" is a distasteful
scenario and arguing that it's unlikely and unnecessary as well