Draco and Dumbledore WAS: Re: Dumbledore Does Lie - Sort Of

[pippin_999]

No: HPFGUIDX 159868

> 
> > > Alla:
> > > 
> > > Actually, I would like **one** example in canon that shows that 
> > > Dumbledore has a history of knowing what is best? 
> > 
> > Pippin:
> > He defeated Grindelwald. He removed the Stone from Gringotts 
> > before it could be stolen by Quirrell. He knew that Voldemort
> > would return and was prepared to take action immediately.
> >  He knew that Hagrid was innocent in Riddle's day and saved him
> > from Azkaban. He recognized that Sirius was innocent and could 
> > be saved if Harry and Hermione used the time turner. He recognized 
> > that Moody was a fake and rescued  Harry. He realized that Kreacher 
> > was lying and rescued Harry and the other Order members. He fought
> > Voldemort in the MoM and rescued Harry -- is that enough? 
> 
> Alla:
> 
> Erm.... my question was where in canon it shows that Dumbledore **has 
> a history of knowing what is best**.
> 
> So, let's go through your examples - he defeated Grimdewald, indeed - 
> if we will learn that he indeed did without hurting many people in 
> process that is  indeed a good one.

Pippin:
Not hurting many people? Gandalf was ready to sacrifice the whole
kingdom of Gondor, man, woman and child, if it meant even a seed
survived the darkness. I can't quote the exact passage because my
LOTR is packed, but he says something like "I shall not have wholly
failed of my task, though Gondor should perish, if anything survives
this darkness that can still grow fair or bear fruit in times to come."
(apologies if I have mangled the quote.)

Gandalf didn't recognize Saruman's treachery in time to save the
children of Westfold, he insisted that Gollum not be killed, which
resulted in the deaths of children in Mirkwood, he wouldn't let
Merry and Pippin be sent back to the Shire to warn their people,
leaving the Shirefolk to be beaten, starved and sometimes killed by
Saruman's lackeys, he insisted that underage Pippin be allowed
to join the Fellowship, and allowed him to swear allegiance to
that maniac Denethor, and let *him* send his own son on a 
suicide mission. Oh, and as a general, Gandalf made very poor
use of the Eagles, although to be fair Tolkien said they were
spiritual powers, not a taxi service. <g>

My point is not to tear down Gandalf, but to show that you
aren't going to make much progress in fighting evil if you're
unwilling to let anyone get hurt. 

> Pippin:
> 
> > 
> > Dumbledore may not have always acted as quickly as we would like,
> > but he still acted before anybody else did. QED.
> > 
> 
> Alla:
> 
> He did not act quickly enough, when he and only he was in the 
> position to act IMO. That in my book translates in **not** having a 
> history of knowing what is best, at all.

Pippin:
We appear to have different definitions of 'best'. You haven't
shown that anyone in the WW could have or has done half as much.

Why is it he and only he was in a position to act? Because nobody
else was alert to the danger and willing to take their head out of
the sand and do something about it. Do you really think Harry
would have been safer in Sirius's hands? I remind you that Sirius's
first plan to protect Harry was the Secret Keeper Switch. His 
second plan was murdering Pettigrew, which would have put
Sirius in Azkaban even if he'd succeeded. Even if Dumbledore
was wrong about the blood protection and wrong about Snape,
which I don't believe for a minute, he still wasn't *that* stupid.

Pippin