Harry as a Non-crux - Soul Pieces in Context

[Ken Hutchinson]

No: HPFGUIDX 158078

--- In HPforGrownups at yahoogroups.com, "Steve" <bboyminn at ...> wrote:
>
> ---  "Ken Hutchinson" <klhutch@> wrote:
> > 
> > Ken:
> > 
> > This core soul anchored to the Earth by a horcrux idea 
> > is the way I have long held horcruxes to work. And then
> > one day it struck me that it was totally wrong, Slughorn
> > clearly says that part of the soul goes beyond when a 
> > horcrux owner is attacked. Presumably it is the part
> > inside the wizard (what many of you call the core soul) 
> > not the part inside the horcrux that goes on since the 
> > horcrux itself was not attacked. 
> 
> bboyminn:
> 
> Could you provide a quote in which Slughorn says that? 
> Because, while there is a certain ambiguity, I don't read
> that in Slughorn's statement at all.
> 
> Slughorn-
> 
> "Well, you split your soul, you see," said Slughorn, "and 
> hide part of it in an object outside the body. Then, even
> if one's body is attacked or destroyed, one cannot die, 
> for part of the soul remains earthbound and undamaged. 
> But of course, existence in such a form ..."
> 
> You could interpret Slughorn as saying "for part of the 
> soul remains earthbound and undamaged" as saying that 
> the part remains but the core is gone. I don't read it 
> that way though. What I read in that fragment is that the
> 'Core' is anchored by the 'part'. In either case, Slughorn
> doesn't specifically say any part crosses over.
> 

Ken:

You provided the quote and you are right, I read it as Slughorn
saying the part of the soul resident in the horcrux owner passes
Beyond. No, he does not say that explicitly although I feel that
is the best reading.

But let's leave that indeterminate. What Slughorn does actually
say is that you cannot die because *part* of your soul remains
Earthbound and undamaged. I question whether the undamaged
clause is relevant since the creation of a horcrux requires that 
you damage the soul and that you make that damage semi-
permanent -- the damage persists at least as long as the 
horcrux remains intact. But let's leave that aside too.

Slughorn says that it is sufficient for your contiued existence
that part of the soul remains Earthbound and undamaged. This
means that the fate of the part that was in the body of the 
horcrux owner at "death" does not matter. It may pass on, it
may remain Earthbound, it may pass on in some circumstances
and not others. We know from LV's testimony that while you
exist in this spectral form you retain your intellect and sense
of self. Since Slughorn says this existence is guaranteed by 
the horcrux regardless of the fate of the soul bit in the horcrux
owner's body, what you and others call the core soul or words to
that effect, Slughorn is saying that there is a third component of
a human being that is the true seat of intellect and self awareness
and this is the part that is guaranteed to survive a deadly attack.
For want of a better term I call this part the spirit.

A few pages later DD contradicts this and tells Harry that it is
indeed your "core soul" that lives on and remains earthbound
as long as one or more of your horcruxes remain intact. The 
implication is that your core soul is the seat of intellect and
awareness and that there is no spirit, or at least it is not 
relevant to the discussion if it exists.

I recognize that there is some ambiguity in Slughorn's statement
but it does not permit the resolution of the fundamental difference
between him and DD. As I've said several times now this could just
be sloppy writing and editing and it could have no implications for
book 7 at all. On the other hand it could be critical. If Slughorn is
right then LV may have no soul bit resident in his body. LV may 
pass on the instant Harry destroys his final horcrux. That would 
make for a very anticlimactic ending unless Harry's scar *is* a 
horcrux that no one knows about. In that case he could go into 
a final confrontation with LV thinking that he has to kill him. LV
could hit him with an AK right in the forehead. The AK could 
kill the soul bit in the scar but leave Harry unharmed while LV
falls to the ground stone cold dead and Harry would not have a 
clue. Hopefully Hermione will survive to explain it all to him. The 
thing is that it leaves Harry alive which most of us want, and it does
not require him to murder LV (unless you count destroying horcruxes
as murder as I do) which rather fewer of us are concerned about.

> bboyminn:
> 
> I think the Spirit of which you speak is part of the Core 
> soul which I also, less frequently, refer to as the Self-
> Soul.

Ken:

No, not in this context. The core soul is the Dumbledorian
concept of the way horcruxes work. The spirit is something
I have added to the Slughornian concept merely for convenience.
It is not explicitly stated but the existence of a seat of self
indpendent of the soul is required by Slughorn's view and 
we may as well call it the spirit. The implication is that this
spirit remains Earthbound as long as a bit of the soul does
and will follow the last soul bit into the great beyond when 
the last soul bit is sent on.

Oh, and here is my wacky, random horcrux theory of the 
day. We know that a spell is required to create a horcrux.
We do not know who is able to cast that spell. Certainly
the wizard/witch who intends to create the horcrux *can* 
cast it. Nothing in canon that I can recall says that *only*
the wizard/witch with the split soul can cast it. Lily was a 
smart woman. Maybe Harry is a horcrux but *not* an 
accidental horcrux. Maybe the spell that Lily invoked to 
protect Harry also made him a horcrux. Maybe she saw the
possiblilty of a future confrontation between Harry and 
LV and wanted to give him an extra shield. I have a hunch
that if you AK a living horcrux you can destroy the 
parasitic soul bit and leave the host intact.

To go even farther into the realm of the wacky, if true 
this might mean that even a Muggle could have a 
horcrux. It would just require a wizard or witch willing
to cast the spell on the Muggle's behalf.

Ken