[HPforGrownups] Re: Question about the prophecy and a thought about Ginny

[sistermagpie]

No: HPFGUIDX 171090

Dana:
I know many have used McGonagall's statement in the hospital wing to 
proof that there must be more to DD's trust in Snape but read the 
quote again. McGonagall never states that DD told her he had an 
ironclad reason to trust Snape. What she really says is that DD 
always *hinted* at having an ironclad reason to trust Snape, the 
ironclad part is her own interpretation for DD's reasons about his 
truth in Snape. (pg 574 UKed PB Chapter "The Phoenix Lament"). 

Magpie:
Actually, I've never heard anyone use McGonagall's statement as proof
there's more to DD's trust in Snape since, as you say, she never suggests
she knows what the reason was. They use Dumbledore's own statements that he
"trusts Snape completely" and point out that he has never shared *why* he
trusts him completely. At one point he looks like he's going to, but he
doesn't. It's an open question. Whether his reason is "ironclad" or not
there's no way to know, because we don't know what the reason is.

Dana:
The only problem unlike James, Snape is not a Gryffindor and although 
Slytherin's as Phineas tells us are not cowards, they will do 
everything to save their own necks first.

Magpie:
FWIW, I wouldn't trust house distinctions too much here. Slytherins don't
necessarily always choose to save their own necks--Regulus, for instance,
appears to have gone to his own death the way Harry would. Draco did not
choose to save his own neck on the Tower by killing Dumbledore. More
importantly, if you want the character who most exemplifies choosing to
save his own neck, that would be Peter Pettigrew, a Gryffindor. (Peter, of
course, would have killed Dumbledore on the Tower.)

Dana:
 Because if the life-
debt is indeed a kind of magic that would request the debtor to 
sacrifice his own life (no he does not have to die just risk it) to 
safe the person they owed the debt to, then Snape's actions to try to 
safe James was because this type of magic left him no other choice 
then to try and that to me makes his remorse story a false one.

Magpie:
Although Peter does not act to save Harry in GoF (despite being indebted to
him), and Snape does not owe a life debt to Harry. Snape's living on
perfectly well having not saved James. Dumbledore starts to say he believes
his remorse over finding out who the Prophecy targeted (and while yes, we
shouldn't turn our ethics on and off depending on if we know the people,
most all our characters do it all the time) was what caused him to
return...(to something, someplace or some state of mind), but Dumbledore
knows about the Life Debt too. He explicitly hints about its power to Harry
re: Peter. So I don't think we can assume that Dumbledore would be tricked
into thinking Life Debt-itis was true remorse. His take on Snape's feelings
towards James are more complex, even knowing their history and how life
debts work.

-m