Hagrid and Draco

[dumbledore11214]

No: HPFGUIDX 168676

> Alla:
> > Do you think Neville should not have been given that lizards or
> > toads cutting detention in GoF? I mean it is a pretty safe
> > speculation to make that he was hurt after breaking another 
cauldron
> > or whatever he got his detention for?
> 
> Magpie:
> I think that's a better analogy and no, I don't, though in Snape's 
case at 
> least he's responding to a pattern--five cauldrons with no 
detentions. The 
> text ascribes that detention to Snape's being more vindictive than 
he has 
> been, which would indicate Harry doesn't think people should get 
detentions 
> for making mistakes in class either. And that Snape hasn't given 
detention 
> for it in the past.

Alla:

I am sorry I got confused with the negatives in question and 
answer :) Do you mind clarifying whether you think Neville should 
have gotten this detention or not? Thanks.

And pattern or not pattern, I think we see an example of student 
getting the detention for something he did wrong in class. I have no 
doubt that Snape was being vindictive of course.

We also see Harry punished by Umbridge for what he did in class, do 
we not?

> Alla:
> > I mean, Malfoy gets rewarded from Snape for being hurt, he is 
also
> > shamelessly gloats that he can use his injury to gets Hagrid 
fired.
> > Shouldn't he also be punished for that?
> 
> Magpie:
> No. Nor should Harry get detention for saying something Malfoy 
thinks is 
> obnoxious. Snape doesn't need to be rewarding Malfoy to want to 
irritate 
> Harry.

Alla:

Huh? I was saying that if it is okay to reward Malfoy for being hurt 
( make Ron cut his roots for him and we know that he is perfectly 
capable of doing so himself), then why is it not okay to punish him 
for being hurt due to his carelessness IMO?

What does it mean "Snape doesn't need to be rewarding Malfoy to want 
to irritate Harry."?


> Magpie:
> For the same reason Neville and Harry and Ron shouldn't be 
punished every 
> time they don't listen in class by anything more than what they 
get--they 
> wind up doing something wrong. Kids don't listen in class every 
minute. 
> Neither do adults. This particular time ought to teach both Malfoy 
and 
> Hagrid something. Malfoy that he needs to always listen when 
Hagrid is 
> talking about a dangerous animal because it might not be obvious 
when he's 
> saying something really important, and Hagrid that he ought to be 
far more 
> clear about danger. Malfoy learns his.

Alla:

Well, sure I know that it can teach them something and no, I do not 
buy that Malfoy learns his lesson. I think he is still being 
obnoxious brat to Hagrid IMO.

But all that I was saying that I would wanted as a reader and 
applaud if Hagrid punished him as well.




> > Alla:
> >
> > Well, since this victim IMO made his life hell for the whole 
year, I
> > think his instinct was right personally.
> 
> Magpie:
> I don't think blaming the victim is a great attitude to take just 
in case 
> the victim turns out to be someone you don't like. Ron didn't seem 
to 
> appreciate it much when he was the victim. Sometimes victims get 
angry. 
<SNIP>

Alla:

No, blaming the victim is never a great attitude to take. What I was 
trying to say is that I find Hagrid attitude to be very 
understandable, because IMO this "victim" ( I just canot call Malfoy 
that) very quickly became an agressor and participated in year long 
witch hunt on Bucky and Hagrid. No, I am not exaggerating, I am 
truly seeing it that way. That is why since I believe that Malfoy 
due to his father truly was in the position of power over Hagrid, I 
am okay with Hagrid blaming Malfoy.

I know we also disagree on that, but I think Malfoy with his 
behaviour traumatised Hagrid a lot. Him being framed again and all 
that.

I find this deed of Malfoy ( oh man, I cannot even call him Draco 
when I type this) to be close in repulsiveness only to planning 
Dumbledore assasination. IMO of course.



Magpie:
<SNIP>
>Nobody in canon ever seems to think it's odd Malfoy doesn't get 
> punished.
> 

Alla:

Sure, but I do not think that anybody would have been very surprised 
if he was punished. IMO of course.

But again my main point is that I wanted him punished. Well, scene 
with Hermione was nice as carmic justice, but I wanted something 
more.

JMO,

Alla