Snape as Harry's protector or not WAS Snape and moral courage LONG

[montavilla47]

No: HPFGUIDX 184693


> Alla:
> Now, I still understand the interpretation that he cared to keep 
> Lily's son alive, but I do not share it anymore. I mean no scratch 
> that before I get carried away again. I am sure he wanted to keep 
> Lily's son alive for the sake of his atonement, guilt, whatever. I 
> just think that all of that took very secondary seat as soon as 
> Dumbledore's orders changed.
> 
> Here is the conversation, anything that I am not typing up is not 
> being done deliberately, but just because I do not feel it is 
> relevant and it is a long quote to type up, so if you feel I missed 
> something relevant, please feel free to correct me. I am starting 
> with Snape's response:

Montvillla47: 
Thanks for typing it up, Alla.  I'm going to cut into your quote 
to comment on what I think is happening in the conversation.

Alla (quoting the text):
> "So the boy... the boy must die?" asked Snape, quite calmly.
> "And Voldemort himself must do it, Severus. That is essential."
> Another long silence. Then Snape said, "I thought... all these 
> years... that we were protecting him for her. For Lily"


Montavilla47:
The calmness Snape shows is not acceptance.  It's shock and 
denial.  This is sort of following that Kübler-Ross model
of people's reaction to death or loss.  She stated that there
are five stages that people go through:  Denial, Anger,
Bargaining, Depression, and finally, Acceptance.  

Alla (quoting the text):
> "We had been protecting him because it had been essential to teach 
> him, to raise him, to let him try his strength," said Dumbledore, his 
> eyes still tight shut. "Meanwhile, the connection between them grows 
> even stronger, a parasitic growth: sometimes I have thought he 
> suspects it himself. If I know him, he will have arranged matters so 
> that when he does set out to meet his death, it will truly mean the 
> end of Voldemort."
> Dumbledore opened his eyes. Snape looked horrified.
> 
Montavilla47:
Again, horror.  Snape is still in shock at this point.  But he'll move
swiftly into anger.

Alla (quoting the text):
> "You have kept him alive so that he can die at the right moment?"
> "Don't be shocked, Severus. How many men and women have you watched 
> die?"
> "Lately, only those whom I could not save," said Snape. He stood 
> up. "You have used me."
> "Meaning?"
> "I have spied for you, and lied for you, put myself in mortal danger 
> for you. Everything was supposed to be to keep Lily Potter's son 
> safe. Now you tell me you have been raising him like a pig for 
> slaughter-"
> "But this is touching, Severus," said Dumbledore seriously.
> "Have you grown to care for the boy, after all?"
> "For him?" shouted Snape. "Expecto Patronum!" – DH, p.551

Montavilla47:
And there we have the anger.  I don't care if there are 
capslocks or not.  I don't care if we don't see spittle flying
from Snape's foaming mouth.  He's angry and he's shouting.

We don't see him go through the other steps.  And Kübler-Ross
notes that no everyone does, so maybe he didn't go through 
them.  Maybe he did and JKR didn't bother to show it.  

What I don't see is Snape in this scene ever actually coming
to acceptance.  Obviously he eventually did.  But I don't see it
in this scene.

One interesting thing about this scene (and the one that 
comes before it) is that this all happens before Harry and 
Draco duel and Snape makes Harry's life even more miserable
than usual with his infamous card detentions.  Since a lot
of stuff Snape does is for reasons not clear in the text, I'm 
not sure what's going on with that still.

Is Snape, knowing that Harry is going to have to sacrifice
himself, just trying to get in as many licks as possible?  Is
he angry at what he knows he's going to have to do next
year and projecting this at Harry?  Is it genuine concern
for Harry's soul?  Is he worried about that soul-bit of 
Voldemort doing something bad if he has his Saturday's free?

Or is it just that he feels, having once been nearly killed
by classmates, that near murder warrants severe 
punishment?

Or did JKR forget that she put this scene before the 
detentions started?  (Dumbledore's remark about Snape 
putting Harry in detention seems to imply that it's after the 
bathroom duel.)

Inquiring minds want to know!

Another thing I'd note is that, among Snape supporters 
anyway, there's a general consensus that Snape is protecting
Harry in "The Flight of the Prince."  So, although this is after
Dumbledore told Snape about Harry needing to die, Snape
is trying to prevent Harry from harm (until he gets angry at
Harry's taunting).   Which makes it fun in retrospect because
he still can't stand the kid.